Mosley's Engine idea

[manchild]

...In my opinion, and yes this is pretty much just communism but isn't that what we are after? equal teams? i think that it should be that all of the teams sponsorship goes into one "account" and then is divided equally so it is still up to the teams how much they get but when there budget is increased so is everyone elses as it is all drawn out equally, Now admittedly like communism this won't actually work either due to the fact some teams have better facilities than others anyway....

I agree, to many reds

He should play more with his grandchildren and stop this outburst of ideas that he has recently.

[Downforce]

Diesel F1 is upon us.

Noup...Solar F1 is upon us.

[dumrick]

It would be a great idea, in my point of view. More: I think that differen fuels should be allowed, with an energetic equivalence ponderation. F1 must stay the pinnacle of automotive technology and, if production cars' technology shifts for new carburants or technologies, then motorsport has always been the best display for these.
I would hate to see F1 as the final circus for dinossaur technologies. Energetic efficiency is paramount nowadays, and what can stimulate the research on this, other than the need for performance?
I'm already disapointed to see sports car racing as the only field where high performance Diesel technology can be really explored and developed (see Audi's and, in a year's time, Peugeot's challenge for Le Mans).
Bring in gas turbines, reaction power, different engine configurations, hydrogen, hybrid power!!!!!

[Bender]

I forget where i read it but someone was saying that in the good ol' days o' F1 driving the car was about managing your limited resources, whether it was brakes, tyres, engines or the car itself, but now that the technology has developed so far you knew the brakes will still be there at the end of the race, or that the engine would not blow up (unless you drive a Merc )

So, as i've been saying for a while now, I think a fuel formula is a great idea, because it gives the drivers a limited resource, fuel. This will allow a lot of the previously banned technologies,i.e rotary engines, Direct injection, VVT, variable length intake/exhaust, possibly even turbos!! ( i doubt it though)

I think it will also tempt a lot of manufacturers to enter into F1 as either engine builders or as factory teams. I think with a bit more thought and planning this could be one of the best things mosley has done for F1 in recent times.

[DaveKillens]

I embrace the idea of allowing freedom in any engine type, I really like that.
But years ago both CART and F1 tried running races with fuel limitations. To be honest, they sucked. I hate fuel mileage racing.
Maybe there's some kind of middle ground allowing freedom of engine choice without resorting to a mileage race. I was thinking along the lines of Lemans style Index of Performance.

[Apex]

Sorry to get into the discussion so late, but this is madness!

Some of you people want a commie F1?
Why not give the teams a big bag with CF, and steel bits and a CNC machine and tell them so make a car using only whats in the bag! Oh yeah, while we are limiting stuff we could also restrict the number of meals served per team - that way they have to limit the number of employees!

I am quite sure that the teams with a chance of winning are rather concerned about fuel consumption.

It is very noble to think that F1 technology will find its way to your basement, but F1 has as much to do with roadcars as the Works Dakar cars have to do with their production versions. Same goes for WRC...

It's not as if the roadcar designers play solitaire all day long. Fuel economy is for most people as important as any feature, this is why diesels are becoming so popular! If you really want to see progress with fuel consumption give the board of directors at merc/bmw a litre of fuel to get to work in the mornings!

[dumrick]

That's just a matter of putting constraints where they are in real life. Anyway, fuel efficiency is as important nowadays as any other thing. Less fuel, lighter car, or increased mileage and best strategic options.
That's just putting F1 research alligned with production cars research, to hope that technologic enhancements made with performance goals eventually may benefit everyday cars.

[Bender]

how about getting rid of fuel stops?

they are dangerous and, personally, they are boring to watch, I think it would enhance the drama of a pit stop, putting more empahsis on the speed and skill of the mechanics, rather than seeing who has the better fuel strategy.

It also makes the cars faster toward the end of the race, because they are running lighter. there is also the slim chance that someone might run out of fuel on the last lap

[Scuderia_Russ]

Now banning refueling would be good all round.

[manchild]

Even Ferrari and Schuey fans are against him

BTW, this is from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Mosley

[joseff]

Well this is getting offtopic but I'd like to share my $0.02

I'm all for banning refueling and economy rules. In my opinion the perfect racing formula would be:
- Regulated specific energy liquid fuel (eg. x Joule/kg) so you have to run on hydrocarbons
- Limited energy input (You start on y Joules, that's it)
- The car has to fit into a box
- One driver on board
- Safety rules (driver safety, fire safety, no spikes, no shooting flames, no rocket launchers)
- That's it

That would be my idea of "the pinnacle of motorsport". Given limited potential energy at the start, you design a vehicle that employs that energy in the most efficient manner, to carry you through to the finish. Doesn't matter if you run 10,20 cylinders, wankel, 2-stroke, hybrid, diesel, whatever. You then fuel that vehicle with the hydrocarbon liquid of your choice (diesel, gasoline, ethanol, kerosene, whatever) and race away.

Imagine: the V12 Ferrari vs V8 supercharged Mercedes vs Honda Hybrid vs Diesel Audi. I disagree with Mosley's notion that this alienates "the man on the street". The cars would all look and sound so different, my gardener would know the difference. You still want "close racing"? Go watch NASCAR.

[Scuderia_Russ]

Even Ferrari and Schuey fans are against him

Blame Mosely for Michelin being unable to produce a suitable tyre? How does that work then?!

[manchild]

I'm not going into that again after 9 forum pages about it

viewtopic.php?t=1367

Anyway, about this latest proposal... same guy who decided only few months ago that CDG wing will save F1 because it will enable overtaking of cars with identical engines, ECUs etc. now comes with another proposal telling us that all cars should be allowed to have any kind of engine even though he imposed unification before 2006, for 2006 and for the 2008.

That is very childish behavior from someone who should have clear vision of the future and make smart moves. I really think that all those proposals we get from Max are just his own attempts to keep his position in FIA. His proposals contradict each other and they sound like they were made buy two men who don't agree about the basic issues.

He realized that his introduction of V8 actually raised costs, made cars are even faster, decreased safety and now he tries to tell fans what they want to hear just to buy some more time.

All he wants is to buy enough time until he makes all teams sign his Concorde agreement even if it takes lying to fans, putting pressure on GPMA or changing rules.

[greenpower dude reloaded]

personally i would very much like to see what the GPMA could do on there own i know it would be a major risk becuase chances are it could well end up being a flop but i think the concept of a championship with the rules created by the teams could be very interesting indeed and i'd love to see them succeed!

However i wouldn't neccersarily want to be at the meeting where the rules are created because i think that would probably go on for quite a while lol and who exactly is in the GPMA i kinda lost track due to all of the teams changing etc. at the end of last season

[manchild]

Reason for forming GMPA isn't in their desire to have another championship but to stand up against FIA heads. GPMA teams want to compete in FIA championship but under equal conditions for all, without people with conflict of interest and dictatorship.

Simply, there was no other way but to threaten by revolution or to actually cause one unless FIA doesn’t stop doing what it’s been doing so far.