Mercedes GP - Inauguration and 1st season

[xpensive]

Very wel xplained jumbo, to the man in the street, as well as the Daimler board, two plus seven makes nine, or more.

Not this time though.

[WhiteBlue]

Free engines untill 2015 is not a shitty deal for McLaren either JET, quite a big help actually.

There is no such thing as a free engine deal for McLaren until 2015. The price for the engines 2010 and 2011 has been factored into the equity buy back deal that was agreed. This deal will be finished at the end of 2011. It would be very strange if Mercedes would provide anything foc to McLaren from 2012.

The logical expectation is that from 2012 McLaren are customers. There is not even a guarantee that McLaren will run Mercedes engines from 2012. All the reports say that Merc have an option to supply McLaren, but it isn't even clear if the option to demand that supply also applies to McLaren. In fact I rather doubt that.

The source for the confusion lies in the separate statements of McLaren and Daimler. They have to be read very carefully to establish what really was agreed.

Mercedes-Benz and McLaren will continue to cooperate with each other and the supply of engines could continue until 2015.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Hi JET

I think part of the problem is, that Mercedes has set themself up into a position, where the can only lose in the short term.

Hi 747

I heartily agree with your sentiments. The only way after doing the double last year is down. For reasons I have gone into extensively of course

For me Mercedes under Zetsche is a far more wieldy and youthful product than it was under Schrempp in the 90's. His vision for Mercedes is to restore it to former glories and to make up for the quality fiasco that they suffered from 1997 to 2004.
He is prepared to take risks.

20 years ago, the cars would have been painted black, running no badge other than "concept by Mercedes-Benz"


But Zetsche has taken the risk, and I applaud him for doing so. The Silver Arrows are a legend as fabled as Ferrari and their return should be applauded.

Lets see where Mercedes goes with this. I hope they stay, but then again if they are being lapped by an energy drinks company, they need to rethink.
Personally I see McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes focussing on GT racing in future( Or somthing more relevant to them)as the battle for kudos amongst supercar makers hots up. F1 is slowly losing its relevance to these guys and with budgets being slashed, there will be scope for racing elsewhere.

I maybe wrong but Ferrari and Mclaren are openly discussing racing each other in other series outside of F1.

Mercedes appetite for F1 will boil down to its 2 main rivals(Red Bull supercars arent available just yet)staying fully commited to F1.
If they they go racing somewhere else, Mercedes may ditch this venture and join them.
As for their currrent standings I will judge Mercedes on the second half of next year, anything from now till then will just be entertainment.

[zeph]

When the BrawnGP takeover was announced, I remember reading an interview with (I think) Dieter Zetsche about the whole thing.

He stated clearly that it was a very good business deal, that made a lot of financial sense. He mentioned being competitive in passing, but emphasised that the main reason for the takeover was a having a works team that was already operating on a smaller budget and thus ideally prepared for the 2011 budget cap.

I'm sure everyone expected more from the Schu. If he was as competitive as Rosberg (94 pnts.) they would still have Ferrari in their sights. That's become a bit of a stretch now, I reckon. But I bet that having Schu and Rosberg is a national pride thing, more than anything else.

[xpensive]

All these speculations on how the Daimler board was/is reasoning are just bullocks, these guys are suits, they don't know or appreciate F1 for a second outside the hospitality suites.

It reminds me of the at the time CEO of Volvo, when he decided to piss away the car division to Ford for a plate of beans.
A close friend of mine had been through university in the same class as him, why he knew him quite well. He told me this CEO was actually the son of the former CEO of SKF, why his first assignement after university was a president's position with one of the Electrolux companies!

Eat it and weep friends, but this is how it works at that level, it's not what you know, it's who you know.

To xpect some understanding on F1 from these guys is preposterous and this is why we have people like Briatore.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

I dont share that pessimsitic view on "suits" xpensive.
Bankers yea, Oil company execs yup. But not Zetsche.

Zetsche has made alot of ballsy decisions for Mercedes, and they are all paying off.
When Mercedes previous execs wanted to go BMW 5 series hunting with the E-class that was released last year, He personally reset the target during development as the W124 Mercedes and not the 5.

Mercedes are reaping the rewards as the E-class is selling as good now as it ever did before. Alot of this is down to Zetsche.

His comments on Mercedes GP having to win is not unreasonable given that Mercedes are a bluechip brand.
People need to raise their game if they want to be a part of this, and Zetsche has done more in one sentence, than the Quandt family ever did for BMW's F1 operation.
This shows the man is passionate about Mercedes, and that he wants it to work.

He is a car man through and through, yea he's a suite. But as far as suits go, he aint a bad one.
And look at that magnificent moustache!

[zeph]

That moustache hasn't seen the inside of Brawn's windtunnel yet.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

That moustache hasn't seen the inside of Brawn's windtunnel yet.

Judging by the W01, I think not only has it seen Brawns windtunnel, but its the ultimate evolution of the front wing!

[andrew]

No wonder the car is crap! Merc are spending money on the upkeep of this guys moustache and have nowt left for the cars!!!

Does the moustache know it has a bloke attached to it?

For walking down the street he could have wing mirrors fitted and no one will ever creep up on him.

There is a joke about handl-bars but it's a bit too blue for this forum!

Anymore moustache relatted gags?

I'm worried about the drag created when he goes swimming or sky diving.

[xpensive]

That moustache hasn't seen the inside of Brawn's windtunnel yet.

Such outrageous facial hair can only happen in...you all know where.

Could only been matched by Reine Wisells 1972 sideburns, pics anyone, Andrew?

[zeph]

That moustache hasn't seen the inside of Brawn's windtunnel yet.

Judging by the W01, I think not only has it seen Brawns windtunnel, but its the ultimate evolution of the front wing!

Yup, design cue for the 2011 car if I ever saw one.

[andrew]

But the award for the most prolific F1 facial hair has to go to Harald Ertl. =D>

[xpensive]

Gosh, almost as hairy as 70s german porn...ooops!

Btw, John Watson had a decent beard at the time as I can remember?

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Xpensive

To get back to my point, Zetsche is a Mercedes man to the core. And an engineer at that!
If he wasnt the head honcho, he would be in the stands with the fans, of that you can be sure.
Zetsche's staunch defence of Mercedes F1 spend to their union in 2009 was testament for his passion to go racing. They had to lay off 15,000 workers, yet bought the F1 team at almsot exactly the same time.

Since then these workers have actually returned to Mercedes as production is ramped up again.

Jurgen Schrempp on the other hand is not someone I would say was as passionate about the company as he was about the bottom line.

Im just glad that Zetsche is at the helm, and if he pulls the plug, that it will be with a heavy heart as this is "his" venture.

[xpensive]

Well you know what JET, we have a saying in Sweden which goes something like "Face of a hockey-game can change fast".

Wonder who on the BMW-board in Munich was for entering F1 as a factory team in 2006 and if the same individuals voted against only a few years later?