Flexible wings controversy 2010

[megz]

Hold up... check out the flex on the MP4-23, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0BkX5sy ... grec_index there is plenty in both the upper element (predictable) but check how much movement there is in the endplate too. How does McLaren NOT know what's going on and how to match the RBR in terms of flex?

[SiLo]

There isn't much movement there, and its the whole thing moving downwards universally, which is easily explained as being a bit too thin.

[wesley123]

The wing itself is moving down a bit too, not in the same rate as the red bull though a little bit.

Flexing wings(and it comes further to that, even mirrors where flexing around 2007) have been done for years now, rear wing flexing is just plain normal(in any direction, I saw the Williams rear wing moving over an horizontal plane, even minardi did it(Barcelona 2002, you do not lose your rear wing for nothing), now one team just excesses in it and it becomes a problem. The front wing isnt even flexing that much, it is the whole car that makes it look like it is flexing.

Some people(me included) thought that the nose cone was moving, I now have to say that i can discard the idea, the moving floor simply allows the team to run much lower front ride heights.

Also, and this is an thing no one has brought up in ages, The team could use some sort of suspension which doesnt absorb vertically, but diagonally. By that way the suspension gets same travel, but rideheight difference will be much less(Thus allows you to run lower, resulting in more DF), afterall you lose alot of the energy over the horizontal plane by doing so. Such an suspension is something new but I am really sure of it being plausible.

Then we have the weird cable sticking out at Belgium. forty-two (And I agree with the theory) said that the cable has to do with stiffness, others say it is just for front wing adjustment. That part is funny as i thought the Red Bull front wing wasnt even movable in any way, even if it was, we havent seen any weird cables sticking out at other cars did we? Sure this cable has to do something with the strength. If they could link it to the gas pedal they can let it flex on the straights for example, and easily let it come up, imo when the car isnt on throttle(or less throttle) the wing isnt nearly moving as much as it is on the straight.

[747heavy]

Also, and this is an thing no one has brought up in ages, The team could use some sort of suspension which doesnt absorb vertically, but diagonally. By that way the suspension gets same travel, but rideheight difference will be much less(Thus allows you to run lower, resulting in more DF), afterall you lose alot of the energy over the horizontal plane by doing so. Such an suspension is something new but I am really sure of it being plausible.

please can you explain this a bit (better) wesley?
What do you have in mind?
RBR using some kind of VW Beetle (old) front suspension - trailing arms?
or are you talking anti-dive geometry?
Thx

[wesley123]

Well I really dont know lol, but somebody bought it up an really while ago about Red Bull's low ride heights. The idea is just simple, regular F1 suspension absorbs its energy by moving vertical, on the red bull it does the same by moving diagonal, thus for the same movement you will have less ride height difference, allowing them to run even lower.

[bgroovers]

Red Bull are still managing to flex their floor in singapore even after the new tea tray test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

Along with the return of the flexing wing in Japan there is no way RB will not do everything to win this years championship.

Still in will be good to see which driver can win the championship for legal cars over the next three races.

This makes my blood boil!

[forty-two]

Red Bull are still managing to flex their floor in singapore even after the new tea tray test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

Along with the return of the flexing wing in Japan there is no way RB will not do everything to win this years championship.

Still in will be good to see which driver can win the championship for legal cars over the next three races.

This makes my blood boil!

Hi bgroovers, do you know anything of the authenticity of this clip? If this is un-edited, I would say that this is the best evidence I've seen yet of a flexi-bib on the RB6

Granted, the example in this clip is when the car is riding the kerbs and not necessarily when extra DF is applied, but there again, it would be harder to see under a steadily increasing DF load. But the flexibility is definitely evident there.

I'm not sure if it's my eyes playing tricks on me, but it also looks like the bib is moving from side to side as well. Could the whole plank be attached in such a way that it can move laterally when under load? Maybe it's sliding backwards and sideways?

[imightbewrong]

Red Bull are still managing to flex their floor in singapore even after the new tea tray test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

Along with the return of the flexing wing in Japan there is no way RB will not do everything to win this years championship.

Still in will be good to see which driver can win the championship for legal cars over the next three races.

This makes my blood boil!

Hi bgroovers, do you know anything of the authenticity of this clip? If this is un-edited, I would say that this is the best evidence I've seen yet of a flexi-bib on the RB6

Granted, the example in this clip is when the car is riding the kerbs and not necessarily when extra DF is applied, but there again, it would be harder to see under a steadily increasing DF load. But the flexibility is definitely evident there.

I'm not sure if it's my eyes playing tricks on me, but it also looks like the bib is moving from side to side as well. Could the whole plank be attached in such a way that it can move laterally when under load? Maybe it's sliding backwards and sideways?

Here is the source:
http://axisofoversteer.blogspot.com/201 ... icane.html

[gibells]

From that clip it has to be said that RB are deliberately trying to deceive the FIA with the supposed stay, one end of which is fixed, with the other end being allowed to slide(?) somewhere within the tub. If I was a member of the FIA I would take umbradge at the fact that I was being deliberately fleeced.

They (a) don't know, (b) don't care, or (c) want Red Bull to win the championship.

The whole saga lends itself towards video refereeing, much like other sports, where hawk-eye or goal-line technology is being discussed, surely there must be place for it in motorsport.

These on-board mounted cameras could surely play more of a role than just bringing us cinematic pleasure.

[forty-two]

Could someone embed this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

I can't work out how it's done DOH!

[gridwalker]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQOWMKE-agw[/youtube]

There ya go, you hoopy frood

(FYI, just click the "youtube" button and paste the full URL in between the tags : you'll need to follow the link and then copy the URL from the address bar)

[forty-two]

Thanks man!

I owe you a pan-galactic gargle-blaster.

[univex]

The rules are there to be bent. The only reason the others complain is because they are not bending them like RBR are.
If macca or ferrari were doing it they would be pointing out like they have done in the past that they pass the tests.

If the flexing front wings are the problem, then just mandate a fixed length and shaped skid plate under the end of the wings that hit the ground so that the wing can't.

[wesley123]

I just have to disagree with the flexing evidence. I mean afterall, the splitter gets an huge inpact hitting the ground, so or it would just be shredded apart or flex like that.

EDIT: NVM the above said, you can see the whole tea tray flexing. This what it actually does at high speeds, then the tea tray comes up allowing an lower front ride height. No fia test can fix this as the bib stay is fixed at some point thus wont bend in that condition, it can only bend up it seems.

[MikeFromCanada]

The rules are there to be bent. The only reason the others complain is because they are not bending them like RBR are.

No pun intended?

And certainly the whole tea tray is flexible and bending upwards. As Wesley said, it's now starting to make sense how it passes the tests.