Ceramic brakes

allan · Post 19 Mar 2006, 08:29

i saw this pic, and i was wondering if these brakes are carbon fiber, or ceramic.
Ceramic is about 160g lighter than carbon but yet, more stiffer...
i heared there are 2 teams using ceramic brakes on this year's grid, any information about it??

manchild · Post 19 Mar 2006, 10:44

Ceramic is banned in F1, those are carbon discs and pads.

Jason · Post 19 Mar 2006, 10:52

manchild wrote:Ceramic is banned in F1, those are carbon discs and pads.

I have'nt heard any car on the grid now uses ceramic brakes

allan · Post 19 Mar 2006, 11:01

i saw a report on tv(made by williams), it claimed that 2 teams are using ceramic materials in each of the four wheels of the car, redusing the average weight from 240g to 80 g.

luisandregg · Post 19 Mar 2006, 14:22

manchild wrote:Ceramic is banned in F1, those are carbon discs and pads.

Sorry if someone has asked this before, but what kind of carbon is that? I mean, carbon fiber, carbon steel, diamond? The only carbon I know that is used in brakes discs is carbon ceramics.

Thanks.

joseff · Post 19 Mar 2006, 15:54

http://www.f1technical.net/articles/2

DaveKillens · Post 19 Mar 2006, 16:17

Although they are not allowed to use ceramic pads or brake disks, there are other applications. Ceramics make fantastic insulators (space shuttle tiles), and I suspect a piece of ceramic is placed between the brake pad and caliper pistons to insulate one from the other.
As shown by allan's pic, there appears to be some kind of rough material separating the brake disk from the suspension uprights and other components. I suspect it is some kind of lightweight, spray on ceramic insulation.

luisandregg · Post 20 Mar 2006, 02:28

joseff wrote:http://www.f1technical.net/articles/2

Nice article! Congrats Tomba!
And thank you joseff.

Ciro Pabón · Post 20 Mar 2006, 03:00

manchild wrote:Ceramic is banned in F1, those are carbon discs and pads.

I think Manchild could be wrong. Ceramic is banned in the reciprocating parts of the engine. The same article in the rules indicates that you can use it in the clutch and seals (Article 5.14.7). But I could not find anything in the rules about brakes that excludes ceramic pads. The calipers have to be made of aluminium, that is all.

Besides, you can imagine that if they allow ceramic material in the clutch, wich is a friction component, they should allow its use in brakes. But you know how F-1 rules are made: they obey the great principle, used by engineers around the world, of "if you can not convince them, confuse them".

Anyway, brake pads are made of carbon fiber, mainly by Brambo, I think. So I guess Manchild is right about the material of the pads. But, again, the photo shows the brake disc. Which is also made of carbon fiber, I know, I know.

manchild · Post 20 Mar 2006, 03:51

My mistake, I thought that it was banned in general for all movable parts of the car.

m3_lover · Post 20 Mar 2006, 07:30

I think the porsche carrera gt is the only production car to use a ceramic clutch?

ginsu · Post 20 Mar 2006, 08:01

Has anybody heard of a Continuous Fiber Carbon Disc Brakes? They are going to have them in Le Mans this year. I'll quote RaceCar Engineering here:

Carbon fibres are very good at conducting heat down their length but they are not very efficient at conducting heat betweeen fibers.

Performance Friction Corp. solved this by weaving the brake disc from a continuous fibre in three directions. This has solved alot of problems with proper heat conduction throughout the disc as previous technology suffered from extreme surface heating. The new discs are alot more stable, and they say that the early designs have had to do away with venting holes, making the discs more rigid.