Mercedes GP W02

[luca]

Yay! So we don't have to wait until the first race to see the new package.
Now let's hope it will just work as expected.

[segedunum]

Problem with tyres plaguing the team? Sort that out first, get an understanding of what the black things do then go for your fancy updates.
Never run KERS? Get the team do 4000kms to test it, get used to it, be comfortable with the tech so that it cannot hamper them during the season.

Alas, the fly in the ointment here is that everything affects everything else on a Formula 1 car because of the variables involved. So any problems you think you have solved with tyres on a ****box will set you back once you put new aerodynamics and mechanical pieces on it because the goalposts move. The packaging will also alter when you change the chassis so any reliability you think you had with KERS on the 'test' box means pretty much nothing.

People keep repeating this kind of flawed logic when it comes to testing, but testing something where you have a very large number of interdependencies cannot be feasibly done in this one-track-mind manner.

[dren]

Brawn just stated that the cooling fix the W02 is using has sapped quite a bit of performance from the car. He said the new package will fix this and will also add performance. I don't know what kind of fix would sap so much performance on the car now other than running a different engine map or some sort of larger radiator. Thoughts?

It doesn't sound like the tires are their main concern.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

People keep repeating this kind of flawed logic when it comes to testing

Whats that? To test factors you yourself lambasted the team for never being able to grasp a hold of.
You yourself said on the W01 thread that the team had a "culture of failing to understand" tyres.

So I put it to you, that you are in fact contradicting yourself. If a team has evidently got issues with tyres and sets out to understand them before adding performance enhancing features, what is the problem? It is in fact logical to do so, given your stance...

[segedunum]

You yourself said on the W01 thread that the team had a "culture of failing to understand" tyres.

No. You yourself have started saying that. It's been one of the standard 'excuses', along with things like weight distribution. Even so, you're not going to understand tyres in the way that they are doing it, so they're still failing.

So I put it to you, that you are in fact contradicting yourself.

No.

If a team has evidently got issues with tyres and sets out to understand them before adding performance enhancing features, what is the problem? It is in fact logical to do so, given your stance...

No it isn't, and you're making up my 'stance' on things now - whatever it is you thought it was. You can't test tyres and think they're OK on a car that you're not actually going to race. All of the much vaunted 'upgrades' Mercedes are apparently going to put on to that car are going to change the car handling and the behaviour of the tyres with it. It's a constantly moving target.

When you test part A and sign it off you then need to make absolutely sure that when you add part B later it won't affect part A otherwise testing part A individually was a waste of time. It's all pretty basic stuff.

[Ferraripilot]

Sorry but the above post is off.

Setting up tires and understanding tires is not a moving target otherwise Mclaren would not have run their previous car for the first test and everyone would hit the test track with the final race ready arrangements. Don't be foolish. Setup has more to do with weight distribution and suspension settings than anything else.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

No. You yourself have started saying that. It's been one of the standard 'excuses', along with things like weight distribution. Even so, you're not going to understand tyres in the way that they are doing it, so they're still failing.

Oh of course yes, you have been praising the teams engineers right?
It was or may have been Xpensive who wrote that, but I get the feeling you 2 are infact 1.

Either way, will you agree to not post on Mercedes threads if the team is not in the top 10 come Oz???

[Giblet]

The car, children, the car. Not your opinions on it.

Stop the frikking bickering in the car threads please.

We don't care about excuses, reasons for pace, just talk about the car, why is that so damn hard?

Take it to PM, but what is the fun in 'knowing' you are right unless you get to argue your point in public right?

[andrew]

The car? Well I see it like this. It's a pup and an untidy one at that. Seeing as it has supposedly been in development since last summer I suggest the following 3 options:

Merc have screwed up

or

they are waiting to see what innovations other teams have then are going to copy the best

or

they have something amazing that will give a massive advantage and they don't want to reveal this until the final moment, thus getting the jump on the other teams, who have possibly not thought of this innovation.

That's the way I see it anyway. We'll soon know which it is.

[ringo]

I will bet 5 euro that the car will look almost exactly the same.
The only difference will be a few cooling holes and some pretty tail pipes.
We've been down this road before with the promised huge ass diffuser and new wing.

If anything it will take a couple races to fully transform the car. The potential is there for the W02, but that's the same for any car with same features.

What i'd like to know is since they were busting holes on top of the sidepods for cooling. In what way will they be able to make the sidepods smaller while having the required cooling flow.
The current pods are bad enough that they have to be busted open.


I think Mercedes are missing a critical aspect of KERS cooling.

see that hole behind the driver's head?





this itty bitty hole can't cool shizzle.So they're probably have the KERS heat exchanger packaged poorly in the side-pods. The radiators are probably competing with the KERS coolers. I'm not sure if we're seeing one right there through the top of the side pod.

see those 2 little heat exchangers tucked away?

Hard to imagine they had the whole year to make this car. I wont expect much downsizing in the sidepods, unless the whole car is revamped systematically.

[Robbobnob]

Seems your bang on the money Ringo

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/89642

Brawn saying their running has been hampered by cooling issues

But also for the forever Mercedes faithful; the 'final spec' car will appear at the Last Barcelona test.

[Ferraripilot]

The sidepods will not be smaller, but definitely reshaped with a radius at the area where it meets the floor; specifically, under the word 'Malaysia' where it currently meets the floor in an abrupt manner.

[Formula None]

Brawn saying their running has been hampered by cooling issues

Is that like Horner saying the Renault engine is down on power?

[xpensive]

Brawn saying their running has been hampered by cooling issues

Is that like Horner saying the Renault engine is down on power?

Not at all, what RB is saying is; "Cooling is another area where we've gone wrong, even with the largest sidepods in the field
we burn the bodywork at places. We'll be back with even bigger sidepods, but in the mean time removing some panels will do.

And no, we do not regard cooling as one of those crucial reliability issues we needed to sort out at an early stage."

[Pandamasque]

The sidepods only seem large. Don't forget they have the shortest car. In fact it is closer that it appears.