Is McLaren really off the pace?

[segedunum]

Maybe they're doing what you've wanted them to do all along - maybe they've just copied Red Bull's solution.

Well, it seems as though they have and found it to be better than any of the other convoluted solutions they came up with.

[raymondu999]

Button says that the car has a lot of good rear downforce. Coming from him, knowing his need for a stable rear, I'd be inclined to believe it.

[gray41]

i think we have to remember as well that mclaren are running these parts for the first time and topping the time sheets is more than i expected they are also showing good pace to RB who have been running their parts at other tests and we all know how good mclaren are at pushing their car development over a season =D>

[imightbewrong]

Last years FP2 + Quali in Bahrain (1st race last year)

FP2

Code: Select all

Pos   No  Driver             Team               Time/Retired  Gap    Laps
1     4   Nico Rosberg       Mercedes GP        1:55.409             23
2     2   Lewis Hamilton     McLaren-Mercedes   1:55.854      0.445  22
3     3   Michael Schumacher Mercedes GP        1:55.903      0.494  23
4     1   Jenson Button      McLaren-Mercedes   1:56.076      0.667  28
5     5   Sebastian Vettel   RBR-Renault        1:56.459      1.050  18
6     10  Nico Hulkenberg    Williams-Cosworth  1:56.501      1.092  26
7     7   Felipe Massa       Ferrari            1:56.555      1.146  30
8     12  Vitaly Petrov      Renault            1:56.750      1.341  26
9     8   Fernando Alonso    Ferrari            1:57.140      1.731  25
10    22  Pedro de la Rosa   BMW Sauber-Ferrari 1:57.255      1.846  24

Quali

Code: Select all

Pos No    Driver             Team                  Q1          Q2          Q3         Laps
1   5     Sebastian Vettel   RBR-Renault           1:55.029    1:53.883    1:54.101   14
2   7     Felipe Massa       Ferrari               1:55.313    1:54.331    1:54.242   16
3   8     Fernando Alonso    Ferrari               1:54.612    1:54.172    1:54.608   20
4   2     Lewis Hamilton     McLaren-Mercedes      1:55.341    1:54.707    1:55.217   19
5   4     Nico Rosberg       Mercedes GP           1:55.463    1:54.682    1:55.241   13
6   6     Mark Webber        RBR-Renault           1:55.298    1:54.318    1:55.284   13
7   3     Michael Schumacher Mercedes GP           1:55.593    1:55.105    1:55.524   15
8   1     Jenson Button      McLaren-Mercedes      1:55.715    1:55.168    1:55.672   17
9   11    Robert Kubica      Renault               1:55.511    1:54.963    1:55.885   17
10  14    Adrian Sutil       Force India-Mercedes  1:55.213    1:54.996    1:56.309   16

Just a small reminder of that it is just practice, they are not out of the woods yet.

[raymondu999]

Or even more relevantly, you could point to the fact that last year, Melbourne FP2 was also a McLaren lockout.

[imightbewrong]

Or even more relevantly, you could point to the fact that last year, Melbourne FP2 was also a McLaren lockout.

That is way too logical for me!

Here you go, Aus10:

Code: Select all

Pos       No        Driver              Team                  Time/Retired     Gap         Laps
1         2         Lewis Hamilton      McLaren-Mercedes      1:25.801                       13
2         1         Jenson Button       McLaren-Mercedes      1:26.076         0.275         16
3         6         Mark Webber         RBR-Renault           1:26.248         0.447         22
4         3         Michael Schumacher  Mercedes GP           1:26.511         0.710         16
5         12        Vitaly Petrov       Renault               1:26.732         0.931         26
6         16        Sebastien Buemi     STR-Ferrari           1:26.832         1.031         29
7         14        Adrian Sutil        Force India-Mercedes  1:26.834         1.033         22
8         15        Vitantonio Liuzzi   Force India-Mercedes  1:26.835         1.034         17
9         9         Rubens Barrichello  Williams-Cosworth     1:26.904         1.103         25
10        4         Nico Rosberg        Mercedes GP           1:26.956         1.155         22

Code: Select all

Pos       No        Driver              Team                  Q1        Q2        Q3         Laps
1         5         Sebastian Vettel    RBR-Renault           1:24.774  1:24.096  1:23.919   19
2         6         Mark Webber         RBR-Renault           1:25.286  1:24.276  1:24.035   20
3         8         Fernando Alonso     Ferrari               1:25.082  1:24.335  1:24.111   22
4         1         Jenson Button       McLaren-Mercedes      1:24.897  1:24.531  1:24.675   19
5         7         Felipe Massa        Ferrari               1:25.548  1:25.010  1:24.837   24
6         4         Nico Rosberg        Mercedes GP           1:24.788  1:24.788  1:24.884   26
7         3         Michael Schumacher  Mercedes GP           1:25.351  1:24.871  1:24.927   24
8         9         Rubens Barrichello  Williams-Cosworth     1:25.702  1:25.085  1:25.217   20
9         11        Robert Kubica       Renault               1:25.588  1:25.122  1:25.372   23
10        14        Adrian Sutil        Force India-Mercedes  1:25.504  1:25.046  1:26.036   24
11        2         Lewis Hamilton      McLaren-Mercedes      1:25.046  1:25.184             13

[segedunum]

Indeed. Subjectively the car looks better, no doubt about it. It's certainly not moving about and doing weird things under braking like it was in testing but it still doesn't look as good as some of its competitors.

However, looking at those free practice times from the first race last year McLaren were right up there but come qualifying I saw a McLaren engineer with a pencil and his head in his hands. Look at Mercedes there as well.

[raymondu999]

Interesting that in Aus 10's FP2 results, they all produced practically identical timings to a tenth. Well swapped over in terms of the two Maccas, but otherwise identical. Can anyone remember if something happened to SV last year to make him miss out on the top 10 in FP2 2010?

[myurr]

Indeed. Subjectively the car looks better, no doubt about it. It's certainly not moving about and doing weird things under braking like it was in testing but it still doesn't look as good as some of its competitors.

However, looking at those free practice times from the first race last year McLaren were right up there but come qualifying I saw a McLaren engineer with a pencil and his head in his hands. Look at Mercedes there as well.

Let's just wait and see. If they're within even a second of Red Bull on Saturday then I think they're in a good place. They have had far less running to date, and therefore less understanding of the car, so they're still learning much more about it's setup and there will be a lot of fine tuning and minor improvements to come. As a new design, rather than an evolution, in theory there is also more potential to come from the car in terms of developments and upgrades.

Given the running we saw today I certainly wouldn't count out any of the top 3 teams from last year, and think all three will be in the running at the end of the season.

Mercedes didn't impress as much today as they did at the last test, so I was a little disappointed by their pace. Could be on a completely different program though. Renault also failed to shine in my eyes, which is a shame as I'd like to see the FEE work well.

[Sean H]

free practices mean nothing, teams all run different programs, and now with the ARW, these one off fast laps have nothing to do with race pace.

Let's see what happens when all teams are on the same page in Q3.

[Hangaku]

Free practice only matters to the fans of the team at the top. Fact.

I also heard that race pace only matters to the fans of the team at the top too. Unconfirmed at this time.

[ringo]

I would put Mclaren in the lower half of the top 5 now, and that's quite fine c0onsidering the running they've had.

[PlatinumZealot]

Told you guys that copying pays off big time!

[raymondu999]

Told you guys that copying pays off big time!

Copying gets you to the same level in less time. HOWEVER, copying at best only gets you to the same level.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Told you guys that copying pays off big time!

Copying gets you to the same level in less time. HOWEVER, copying at best only gets you to the same level.

If you understand the concept of what is being copied, it should be expected that you improve on the original.