McLaren MP4-26 Mercedes

[feynman]

So you're saying they gained 2,5 seconds in 2009 only due to their "outwash" front wing ?

Doesn't really matter what I say, why don't we just ask the guy driving the car, a coupla weeks before they finally bolted on the outwash wing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qP-_W3lLeXQ

The car went from what was described in that communication, to a race winner (or would have been till Webber clumsily clattered into it), next three race distances with the outwash front wing were win, second, and then win again.

But by end of 2009 it was being beaten by Toyotas and BMWs, which again suggests that the upgrade cycle was not as relentless or as unfailingly successful as media-soundbite conventional wisdom wants us to believe.

[Javert]

Maybe you're right, but don't stop at "photographable" or visible changes

Take the MP4-26 (so we return to topic):

From Aussie to Malesia race car didn't change much, the diffuser was the same ... But their qualifying pace was better and the start was slighty enhanced. They recorded hard tyres issues.

From Malesia to China they moved to a carbon-fiber diffuser, a change that generally would improve balance ... But this is not enough to explain the start, which improved a lot since Malesia, and hard tyres was not anymore a problem.

If we want to evaluate VISIBLE things that McLaren had taken this year, I would definitely say:

L-shaped sidepods: WORKED
Flexi nose / front wing: (partially) WORKED
Octopus: didn't work
Titanium floor / diffuser: WORKED
First (Malesia) carbon fiber diffuser: didn't work
Second (China) carbon fiber diffuser: (partially) WORKED *

* in the sense they expected more gain of downforce than the gain they had.

This is a good work IMHO

[PlatinumZealot]

Because Malaysia has a different characteristic from the AUS and China tracks, it is not that clear whether the parts or the car as a whole were improved or not.

[hollowBallistix]

I love how everyone lately seems to be quoting & referencing forum gossip & speculation as fact !

At no point has McLaren ever admitted to the "Octupus" and none of the drivers have stated the performance regarding just this mythical devise !!!

Whitmarsh has stated that they had some radical features that would have added good performance, however because of the unreliability of them, they couldn't do enough milage in testing to really unlock the potential, but no-one really knows what these features were.

But you can be guaranteed that if they are to offer performance gains then they will be working on the reliability issues with them back at MTC so they can try them on the cars at somepoint through the season.

[Owen.C93]

Of course we don't know whether the exhaust actually resembles an Octopus, but we can still call their radical and complicated exhaust system that for now. Even if it's just for clarity.

Oh and incase you missed any interviews, Whitmarsh did actually say they had a complicated exhaust that they had to ditch pre season because it was unreliable and wasn't giving enough performance.

[hollowBallistix]

Of course we don't know whether the exhaust actually resembles an Octopus, but we can still call their radical and complicated exhaust system that for now. Even if it's just for clarity.

Oh and incase you missed any interviews, Whitmarsh did actually say they had a complicated exhaust that they had to ditch pre season because it was unreliable and wasn't giving enough performance.

From all the interviews i've seen performance was not the issue, it was reliability.

There's no point in running a concept that's 1 second faster over a lap than every other car if it won't last the race distance, reliability comes first.

[Owen.C93]

Of course we don't know whether the exhaust actually resembles an Octopus, but we can still call their radical and complicated exhaust system that for now. Even if it's just for clarity.

Oh and incase you missed any interviews, Whitmarsh did actually say they had a complicated exhaust that they had to ditch pre season because it was unreliable and wasn't giving enough performance.

From all the interviews i've seen performance was not the issue, it was reliability.

There's no point in running a concept that's 1 second faster over a lap than every other car if it won't last the race distance, reliability comes first.

I heard it wasn't performing as expected either, though that may have been because of warping and such like.

We may see it return on a Friday if they can find a suitable material.

[hollowBallistix]

.......

all asumptions based on forum gossip.

no one really knows what their solution was & why it wasn't reliable, a pyrosic "octopus" has never been confirmed by McLaren

[ringo]

......

all asumptions based on forum gossip.

no one really knows what their solution was & why it wasn't reliable, a pyrosic "octopus" has never been confirmed by McLaren

true. That's why i call it the loch ness exhaust.

[Formula None]

[Mandrake]

From Aussie to Malesia race car didn't change much, the diffuser was the same ... But their qualifying pace was better and the start was slighty enhanced. They recorded hard tyres issues.

From Malesia to China they moved to a carbon-fiber diffuser, a change that generally would improve balance ... But this is not enough to explain the start, which improved a lot since Malesia, and hard tyres was not anymore a problem.

Different tracks, different weather. You cannot really too much into it.

The start in China does not tell too much either, Vettel f***ed up his start so the McLarens with good starts could walk him.

If you looked at it your way, MGP is the team that did wonders, from nirvana to leading the race for a couple of laps only to be stopped by not enough fuel. I would never say they are faster than McLaren or RedBull though...just the circumstances benefitted them!

[speedsense]

IMHO, the presumed "Octopus" was a testing device that was hydraulically operated, and allowed the team to blow the exhaust in different locations either as a dual exhaust or in multiple, merely by switching (hydraulically) the pathways out of the "Octopus". Both problems, hydraulic & exhaust (the high numbers of them) went away after the "presumed" removable of the device. As Whitmarsh stated "it was an educational process, even with the failures."...does Mclaren now know more than RBR about blowing exhaust, thanks to their testing process? Seems they jumped right away to a successful working blown diffuser....
Also, as the "noise" about flexible front wings has died down, with no apparent further action from the FIA, Turkey will have flexible front wings from a few teams, most likely Mclaren, as they seem to now have ample rear downforce and new front wing (at China) and a need for more front downforce. The teams have made more noise this year than last, about RBR's front wing, especially Mclaren and like last year Ferrari, apparently to get the FIA to move further on testing weights and tech procedures.
Having seen nothing being changed by the FIA, we should be entering an era of flexing front wings from more than one car.....

[aral]

IMHO, the presumed "Octopus" was a testing device that was hydraulically operated, and allowed the team to blow the exhaust in different locations either as a dual exhaust or in multiple, merely by switching (hydraulically) the pathways out of the "Octopus". Both problems, hydraulic & exhaust (the high numbers of them) went away after the "presumed" removable of the device. .....

There is nothing to even consider this possibility. Such a controllable device would be totally against the regs, and McLaren would not risk running an illegal system.

[Javert]

IMHO, the presumed "Octopus" was a testing device that was hydraulically operated, and allowed the team to blow the exhaust in different locations either as a dual exhaust or in multiple, merely by switching (hydraulically) the pathways out of the "Octopus". Both problems, hydraulic & exhaust (the high numbers of them) went away after the "presumed" removable of the device. .....

There is nothing to even consider this possibility. Such a controllable device would be totally against the regs, and McLaren would not risk running an illegal system.

In testing you can do anything, there are no controls ... He was saying they used Octopus to discover where is better to blow exhausts.

I think however that Octopus was a real exhaust system and not a testing device

[djos]

Frankly I dont know how they thought it would be passed by the FIA, the rules are super clear that you are only allowed to have 2 exhaust exits as back in the 80's things got a bit silly with multiple outlets feeding diffusers.