Red Bull RB7 Renault

[hardingfv32]

It is hard to believe that the other engine manufactures cannot match the engine maps used by RB if they choose. These maps are easy to manipulate and simulate on computer. No big deal to verify results and reliability of the engine on the dyno. These are all things that can be done without regard to test restriction. This is not where the advantage is.

Brian

[rayden]

im quite sure its because the pirellis cannot handle the sort of forces the RB7 puts through them in the high speed bends for any more than 1 or 2 laps at a time. Both Vettel and Webber seem to run out of tyres fairly quickly in their first stints compared to mclaren. I think when the RB7 really stretches its legs in Q3 (turn 9 this weekend at 250kms) it just smashes the tyre too much.

The tyres are a bottle neck this year. especially when u have to make them last a stint.

[PlatinumZealot]

It's possible RB run a very aggresive retarded ignition engine map for qualifying only, burning more fuel and putting more heat through the exhaust, something they probably can't do for an entire race distance.

I don't think Red Bull were a full second slower in the race, I think McLaren were faster as well. McLaren certainly didn't look that fast in qualifying compared to Ferrari/Merc.

Agreed.

I have been thinking for a while on what has been happening with the RB7's qualification times and how it's vastly destroying the competition at present. What we know right now for a fact is that during qualification RB are able to deploy their DRS in places where the next closest runners, McLaren, can't. This is showing significant downforce through the high speed corners with their qualification setup. We know the RB has a great high speed cornering ability, but with the DRS enabled?

This points to RB having a different and much, much more aggressive engine map. One that is configured to blow the defuser in a way that cannot be repeated in race conditions, potentially due to fuel or other mechanical restrictions that make it vastly unsustainable.

Do the rules allow for such aggressive engine map changes between qualification and the race?

Either way, got to hand it to them, fantastic car.

It's just that RBR have more downforce all over. The engine map is a reason, but that really doesn't vary that much from mercedez or ferrari. The major reason they destroy everybody else in qually is because 1) their downforce is about 5% more that everybody elses and combined with the fact you can use DRS at anytime. This cancels out redbull's top speed disadvantage.

Inversely, In the race they are slower because they cannot use the DRS as they please, but on the other hand though being slower on the straights they still retain their high speed cornering ability. For the other teams using the DRS does not give them as large an advantage as RedBull in qualifying (who can even use DRS in the turns).

[beelsebob]

Agreed.

I have been thinking for a while on what has been happening with the RB7's qualification times and how it's vastly destroying the competition at present. What we know right now for a fact is that during qualification RB are able to deploy their DRS in places where the next closest runners, McLaren, can't. This is showing significant downforce through the high speed corners with their qualification setup. We know the RB has a great high speed cornering ability, but with the DRS enabled?

This points to RB having a different and much, much more aggressive engine map. One that is configured to blow the defuser in a way that cannot be repeated in race conditions, potentially due to fuel or other mechanical restrictions that make it vastly unsustainable.

Do the rules allow for such aggressive engine map changes between qualification and the race?

Either way, got to hand it to them, fantastic car.

It's just that RBR have more downforce all over. The engine map is a reason, but that really doesn't vary that much from mercedez or ferrari. The major reason they destroy everybody else in qually is because 1) their downforce is about 5% more that everybody elses and combined with the fact you can use DRS at anytime. This cancels out redbull's top speed disadvantage.

Inversely, In the race they are slower because they cannot use the DRS as they please, but on the other hand though being slower on the straights they still retain their high speed cornering ability. For the other teams using the DRS does not give them as large an advantage as RedBull in qualifying (who can even use DRS in the turns).

Yep, I've written this many times – DRS inherantly gives the more downforcy car a bigger advantage in qually than the race. The more downforcy car can have it open deeper into corners, all the way round some of them, and open sooner in the corners. They still make the corner and have a much much much higher entry/exist speed because of it.

I'm pretty sure that can explain the RBR's pace in qually almost entirely.

[sriraj1031]

DRS mate DRS, sole reason for them to be so good in quali;

I have seen in one of the qualifying session (guess its either turkey or china) Vettel activating it n the turns, that's the amount of down force they have got

[doink]

It's possible RB run a very aggresive retarded ignition engine map for qualifying only, burning more fuel and putting more heat through the exhaust, something they probably can't do for an entire race distance.

I don't think Red Bull were a full second slower in the race, I think McLaren were faster as well. McLaren certainly didn't look that fast in qualifying compared to Ferrari/Merc.

Agreed.

I have been thinking for a while on what has been happening with the RB7's qualification times and how it's vastly destroying the competition at present. What we know right now for a fact is that during qualification RB are able to deploy their DRS in places where the next closest runners, McLaren, can't. This is showing significant downforce through the high speed corners with their qualification setup. We know the RB has a great high speed cornering ability, but with the DRS enabled?

This points to RB having a different and much, much more aggressive engine map. One that is configured to blow the defuser in a way that cannot be repeated in race conditions, potentially due to fuel or other mechanical restrictions that make it vastly unsustainable.

Do the rules allow for such aggressive engine map changes between qualification and the race?

Either way, got to hand it to them, fantastic car.

It's just that RBR have more downforce all over. The engine map is a reason, but that really doesn't vary that much from mercedez or ferrari. The major reason they destroy everybody else in qually is because 1) their downforce is about 5% more that everybody elses and combined with the fact you can use DRS at anytime. This cancels out redbull's top speed disadvantage.

Inversely, In the race they are slower because they cannot use the DRS as they please, but on the other hand though being slower on the straights they still retain their high speed cornering ability. For the other teams using the DRS does not give them as large an advantage as RedBull in qualifying (who can even use DRS in the turns).

Right okay, makes sense.

Do you know where we can get historical race information, including each car's top speed, particularly for Spain? Would be a fascinating comparison to see this concept in action. I know from the TV footage that their straight line speed isn't as great as the McLaren's but I'm a stickler for some proper comparisons.

[marcush.]

It seems quite obvious that RedBull is using their DRS differently to the opposition ..effectively they use it as a Aero setup switch in Qualy where all the others just use it to gain straightline speed.
Reducing drag for 3quarters of a track + being able to have more downforce in the slower corners will help lap time no question..
But how do they manage things in the race when they cannot reduce rear downforce at will? This must be influencing balance in high speed corners towards understeer,right? or can they use the fuelload to counter these effects?(overloading the rears enough to get back the balance..)

[CyleB]

That s an interesting thought and i would love the chance to pick one of their engineers brains

[zac510]

Did anybody else think that Webber being asked to use 45% of his KERS before turn 1 was possibly because there's only that one big braking corner from which to harvest energy?

[marcush.]

is kers necessaryly empty when you cross the line? no ,I don´t think so.You get your allocation of energy when crossing the line signed off for release but it says nothing about the enrgy stored in the system ,right?

[zac510]

Sure, but you need to discharge some so you can recharge it. The amount of storage is finite.

[i70q7m7ghw]

The KERS is so efficient that it's very rare for it to actually be empty, it's recharging everytime the driver brakes. The % usage is just a % of allocation for that lap, no relation to actual charge in the system.

I think what we saw during the race was a combination of Red Bull managing the cooling of KERS, by turning the system off for short periods; and a assisting the driver in where best to discharge KERS.

[adrianjordan]

I would love to see a side by side comparison of the Red Bull and McLaren from the rearward facing camera on their Q3 lap. Would be fascinating to see the difference in when they deploy the DRS.

If anyone from the BBC is reading this, please could you make it happen for the build up to Monaco?

[marcush.]

Sure, but you need to discharge some so you can recharge it. The amount of storage is finite.

That´s true but we don´t know how much capacity they have ,surely a lot more than they are allowed to deploy per lap as that would kill the storage device in no time.So lets assume the batteries are 50%Charged already when crossing the line this is enough to give the driver 100% availability of KERS as he is starting the lap.

[marcush.]

Sure, but you need to discharge some so you can recharge it. The amount of storage is finite.

That´s true but we don´t know how much capacity they have ,surely a lot more than they are allowed to deploy per lap as that would kill the storage device in no time.So lets assume the batteries are 50%Charged already when crossing the line this is enough to give the driver 100% availability of KERS as he is starting the lap.