End of oil and F1

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
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joseff
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Tom, Ciro, I'm in total agreement that the amount of oil we have is finite. However, the current hysteria about oil price, peak oil and global warming is more political noise than sound science. Be careful when taking sides. There is massive interest in drilling the Alaskan Wildlife Reserve. As Ciro pointed out, even Ethanol is a white elephant. It's not going to scale. In several countries, even this is being politicized.

I'm totally advocating that we move away from oil. It's old, dirty, and surely, after 200 or so years, we can do better? The more exposure through a global sport, say, F1, the more money available for research. This can only be good.

All I'm saying is, don't buy ethanol fuel or use natural gas heating, whatever just because you want to save oil. That's not going to solve our oil problems, just delay it. No, as in the past, we should switch, and it should be entirely for economical reasons. And I'm sure that in the end, we'll make the switch before we run out of oil and not because we run out. That's what I meant by "We'll never see the end of oil."

for those still thinking that "green" means "Millhouse":
http://www.seriouswheels.com/top-2005-V ... Fetish.htm
Surely, billions in F1 research can do much better?

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Ciro Pabón
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Look at what you made me google: (1.1 Mb) "A feasibility study on the role of motorsports in the development of energy efficient automotive technologies", by your friendly guys at the Motorsports Industry Association. I know, it is 40 pages long, and it is deffinitely a "comittee work" but it sums it all, and the comittee includes Ricardo MTC, Reynard Motorsports, Lola, Dunlop and the bunch.

Even the oil part has a no-nonsense approach, that agrees with my conclusions (what a coincidence! 8) ). I knew you are never alone at the World Wide Wait. They even agree with Joseff and me, being in this a true jewel of comittee work: gasoline will have a surplus, and diesel and GNV will prevail!

Besides, look at what Milhouse and his friends did after the solar race (another long-PDF warning): they put Formula SAE in the uncomfortable situation of banning regeneration systems. Formula SAE, he, he, he. :lol: Sort of flexi-wings on batteries... notice how cleverly Mosley circumvented this problem already in the 2008 regulations.

Shall they ruin Alaska, joseff? Naaaahhhh, trust me, they are just doing fine at Iraq... Let me quote George W: "This will hold'em, using their primitive oil, while the aliens extract all the dilithium, muahahaha!"

You have been warned. They were checking us at Monaco last year! Bernie is too small! Schuey has a noticeable pause between the processing of information and the displaying of emotions! :wink:

Finally, let me quote Milhouse himself, the man, the myth, the genius:

"Remember the time he ate my goldfish? And you lied and said I never had goldfish. Then why did I have the bowl Bart? Why did I have the bowl?"
Ciro

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joseff
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Interesting paper Ciro, thanks.

On the FSAE subject: really, they're banned? Could someone competing in FSAE please comment on this?

And does someone know what the hell happens to Panoz' Sparky?

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Ciro Pabón
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joseff wrote:Interesting paper Ciro, thanks.

On the FSAE subject: really, they're banned? Could someone competing in FSAE please comment on this?

And does someone know what the hell happens to Panoz' Sparky?
Sorry, I should have giventhis link. Here it is where they talk about the SAE banning them.

I googled through Sparky but I only found references to 1998 LeMans. I found also Toyota's Racing Prius, the BMW HR2 and K1 Attack, but I did not find them very interesting, even if I thought of posting the K1 claim of being "faster than a new Ferrari" just to see Manchild's reaction. :)

BTW, Manchild, you made me laugh with the bio-sh** for a while... Let's burn, man...
Ciro

manchild
manchild
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Joined: 03 Jun 2005, 10:54

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joseff, those figures for electric powered car are great but F1 without roaring sound F1 wouldn't be F1. I think ve're mixing where lies the future of F1 with where lies the future of passenger cars. I'm certain that hybrid will give no result untill some unified new fuel/system gets underway that will enable production of passenger cars with costs and performance of ones powered by oil. Anyway, oil will last for years and years so I'm not worried about that since it won't affect F1 in my life time.

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Ciro Pabón
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manchild wrote:Anyway, oil will last for years and years so I'm not worried about that since it won't affect F1 in my life time.
You are right, it won't affect F1 in our lifetime. But we are talking about what can happen beyond 2010... :D
Ciro

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Scuderia_Russ
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Joined: 17 Jan 2004, 22:24
Location: Motorsport Valley, England.

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Tom wrote:Fiona Leggate (Nice looking girl, seems unlucky) runs a bio-ethanol car in the BTCC but it seems drasticly underpowered. Could be her driving though.
It is quite hard to tell isn't it Tom? :lol:
"Whether you think you can or can't, either way you are right."
-Henry Ford-

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Scuderia_Russ
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Location: Motorsport Valley, England.

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Nick wrote:Basically it boils down to the fact that no one really knows for sure and all the "facts" that people are relying on are just predictions.
I know what you mean, but it's the sort of problem that can only be sorted out proactively not reactively otherwise we will be sorely unprepared for it.
"Whether you think you can or can't, either way you are right."
-Henry Ford-

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Ciro Pabón
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Well, Russ, she seems pretty "over-powered" to me.

Image

I wonder what's behind those trophies.
Ciro

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jezzwa
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Joined: 02 Jan 2006, 14:04
Location: Adelaide, South Australia

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Headlights....? :shock:
Vote 1 for GPs back in Adelaide

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flynfrog
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Joined: 23 Mar 2006, 22:31

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manchild wrote:joseff, those figures for electric powered car are great but F1 without roaring sound F1 wouldn't be F1. I think ve're mixing where lies the future of F1 with where lies the future of passenger cars. I'm certain that hybrid will give no result untill some unified new fuel/system gets underway that will enable production of passenger cars with costs and performance of ones powered by oil. Anyway, oil will last for years and years so I'm not worried about that since it won't affect F1 in my life time.
i have seen an electric open wheel race it was actuly pretty intresting a pack of 20 cars and alls you can here is the air coming off of them

but i agree Ive spent 4 yeras trying to build the most efficent solar car i can but when im doing that i want to here a screaming v10 buring all the fuel it can for a few hours

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Ciro Pabón
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jezzwa wrote:Headlights....? :shock:
I was thinking about "the gentle touch of a driver and the muscular and well toned back and neck of a high speed pilot", but if you prefer...
Ciro

pompelmo
pompelmo
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Joined: 22 Feb 2004, 16:51
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I think you all will not live to tell the tail for the end of oil...for the future, as far as my concern (spelling?) i don't care about things that are going to be wheni'm cold.

axle
axle
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Joined: 22 Jun 2004, 14:45
Location: Norfolk, UK

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Max is keen to save money...and so why don't they ban refuelling again? Limit them to 100L's and scrap the stupid top ten tour fest in the last qualifying "battle" - just have a light tank and go for it 1 after the other Super Pole style.

This also saves the cost of those refueling rigs (£50k I heard) which fail half the time and just make pit stops dangerous.

I like the idea of limited Kj's of energy to allow other fuel types but stage one is to ban refuelling.
- Axle

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Tom
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Joined: 13 Jan 2006, 00:24
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I have been saying this for a while. Many people have been dissadvantaged by the stupid refueling, Button for instance is the latest victim. That could have been horendus if that had caught fire. Even Mr Michael 'Lucky' Schukey has had problems. Its not worth it. Whats more we will go back to 4s pit stops.

I hope the FIA read this forum!
Murphy's 9th Law of Technology:
Tell a man there are 300 million stars in the universe and he'll believe you. Tell him a bench has wet paint on it and he'll have to touch to be sure.