Mercedes GP 2011

[bhall]

Are Merc still contracted to supply McL engines for years to come?

Through 2015. I think.

[raymondu999]

AFAIK they're contracted thru 2012 and have an option to bring it up thru to 2015. The rumors back then were that McLaren were going to buy the BMW F1 engine operation

[MIKEY_!]

All bets are off for a while cause of the new engine regs anyway.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

On a totally different note, I recall that one of the reasons for Merc selling their shares in McL was because Ron ultimately wanted to build his own engine and run a 'works' McL. I also assumed that this was a large part of the reason why Merc suddenly became interested in buying a F1 team as they would no longer be supplying engines to a successful team.

Can someone say what happened to the idea of McLaren building their own engines? Are Merc still contracted to supply McL engines for years to come?

Once Merc have the team in a place where it is consistently running in the top three would they really want to continue supplying technology to a team that can threaten their chances of being WCC? McL must know this so it will be interesting to see who blinks first and breaks the deal.

there was talk of this, but McLaren are straddled with debt from paying Merc back £100million+ for the team as well as losing their 80million benefit in kind each season. Thats a massive deficit, so I think we wont see Mclaren do engines until at least 2017 at the earliest, when you consider setting up an engine factory and then the lead time in development. Besides they have a contract for Mercedes engines until 2015.

[MIKEY_!]

AFAIK they're contracted thru 2012 and have an option to bring it up thru to 2015. The rumors back then were that McLaren were going to buy the BMW F1 engine operation

[roadwarrior]

there was talk of this, but McLaren are straddled with debt from paying Merc back £100million+ for the team as well as losing their 80million benefit in kind each season. Thats a massive deficit, so I think we wont see Mclaren do engines until at least 2017 at the earliest, when you consider setting up an engine factory and then the lead time in development. Besides they have a contract for Mercedes engines until 2015.

I guess that makes sense although saying that, 2014 when the new engine regs come into play could be a logical point for McL as everyone is basically starting from scratch and there is no guarantee that Merc will still be the strongest engine. AFAIK Merc have very little turbo experience although they still have forced induction experience via superchargers.

I'd like to see more engines in F1.

[MIKEY_!]

Who else does small turbo racing engines. Renault and Cosworth should be ok Benz may struggle and Ferrari have very little experience (i think). A complete reversal then. Of course i am not taking into account the biggest factor... cash.

[raymondu999]

Cosworth does turbo? Most of Merc's road engines are aspirated; except for the C-class line which uses Kompressors. On a 4-cylinder arrangement too if I'm not mistaken

[wunderkind]

Mercedes, and Volkswagen, are the two engine suppliers to the European F3 championships

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Modern turbos have moved on quite alot since even 3 years ago.

New technology is being implemented all the time, so I think every engine supplier will be starting from scratch and from pretty much the same place.

Roadwarrior
I think 2014 is still too soon for macca to make their own engines. But I agree more engine suppliers would be good for F1.

For Mercedes, I think they would prefer to keep their supply to Mclaren as they still benefit when Mclaren win(Benz badging etc). What will be interesting is that from 2013 Mclaren will lose their veto as to whom gets the F0108X V8.

Mercedes have been contacted by Red Bull in the past regards supply of engines but this was quickly dismissed by McLaren.
I wonder wether Mercedes would be open to supplying a major competitor(RB) once the veto rights have expired(and Force Indias supply contract) with their hardware in exchange for high profile badging as well as the wunderkind at the steering wheel? They wouldnt need to bust the bank to land Vettel and every time Red Bull win its chalks up another Mercedes powered victory.

The F1 landscape will be very different in 2014 methinks.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

The 5litre turbo Mercedes V8 C9's(Sauber Mercs group B car) werent half bad either.

[raymondu999]

I think a young German champion powered by Merc engines would be good media for Merc; I think they value their F1 engine business very much and won't detune their engines. An RB9 powered by Merc... not sure what that would look like; but the engine regs would probably mean teams might go for stability with a known supplier instead though.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Perhaps the works team will veto it.

All depends on Mercedes Gp's progress in 2012.

[raymondu999]

I agree. If they're a winning team in 2012; competing directly on the same level with red bull, I doubt they will want to supply Red Bull. Red Bull IIRC is the first customer engine team in a long while to actually win a race, let alone a championship or two.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Plus it would be easier to prize Vettel away from Red Bull.