2014-2020 Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

[ringo]

Yes, but all goes to the compressor. It may help the compressor characteristics a little, as it would be harder to stall, but ram effect is negligible because the boost controller is operating in a closed loop.

[FW17]

Will 2014 see HCCI technology introduced in F1

[WhiteBlue]

Will 2014 see HCCI technology introduced in F1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homogeneou ... n_ignition

There is certainly a trend towards leaning the combustion as much as possible and increasing the compression ratio. But I doubt very much that this will be pushed up into HCCI territory.

I seem to recall that they still specify spark plugs which would be unnecessary if HCCI was allowed. There is also the problem that HCCI usually needs some kind of exhaust treatment which would be a problem with the noise lovers.

So I rather think they will increase compression ratio by doing a very fast and late super high pressure direct injection only some milliseconds before the firing point. The speed and the delay of the injection in the compression stroke will be crucial and it will be almost self ignition quality in my view but not quite HCCI level.

Generally we can expect all technologies that bring fuel efficiency and have no additional problems - like noise suppression - to be applied. They will try to eliminate throttling losses and thermal losses by reshaping the l/D ratio. The current flat pistons are not very good on thermal efficiency and the new engines will rev a lot lower than the 21.000 that were initially targeted for the current V8 in 2005. I don't think they will be regularly doing 15.000 rpm. The working range should be more like 11.000 - 13.000. This means the pistons can be much longer than they are now in relation to the diameter.

[FW17]

Will 2014 see HCCI technology introduced in F1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homogeneou ... n_ignition

There is certainly a trend towards leaning the combustion as much as possible and increasing the compression ratio. But I doubt very much that this will be pushed up into HCCI territory.

I seem to recall that they still specify spark plugs which would be unnecessary if HCCI was allowed. There is also the problem that HCCI usually needs some kind of exhaust treatment which would be a problem with the noise lovers.

So I rather think they will increase compression ratio by doing a very fast and late super high pressure direct injection only some milliseconds before the firing point. The speed and the delay of the injection in the compression stroke will be crucial and it will be almost self ignition quality in my view but not quite HCCI level.

Generally we can expect all technologies that bring fuel efficiency and have no additional problems - like noise suppression - to be applied. They will try to eliminate throttling losses and thermal losses by reshaping the l/D ratio. The current flat pistons are not very good on thermal efficiency and the new engines will rev a lot lower than the 21.000 that were initially targeted for the current V8 in 2005. I don't think they will be regularly doing 15.000 rpm. The working range should be more like 11.000 - 13.000. This means the pistons can be much longer than they are now in relation to the diameter.

They say that HCCI works only at low RPMs, any reason why? or is it that controlling detonation at higher RPMs are just not possible

[Edis]

Will 2014 see HCCI technology introduced in F1

No, HCCI (homogeneous charge compression ignition) is limited to part load operation (low bmeps) and would not be useful in F1. The advantage with HCCI is that it allows lean operation with near zero NOx emissions. For a roadcar that means a regular three way catalyst can be used to deal with the HC and CO emissions even though the engine is running lean (a three way catalyst can't reduce NOx when there is an excess of oxygen in the exhaust). There also isn't any need for a low emission engine in F1.

I find it unlikely that the engine manufacturers will use anything else than homogeneous charge spark ignition with direct fuel injection during the intake stroke (the "early" fuel injection is to achieve a homogeneous charge). That's how direct injected gasoline engines operate at high load and speed, and also how direct injected racing engines operate. At low loads and speed some direct injected gasoline engines operate lean with a stratified charge - that is air with a mixture of fuel and air just around the spark plug. To achieve a near stoichiometric mixture near the spark plug one late directed fuel injection is done. The main advantage of stratified charge operation is reduced losses at part load, mainly pumping losses.

For racing engine the main fuel saving effect is that direct injection allows leaner operation due to the fact that less fuel is lost during valve overlap.

[strad]

WB said

There is certainly a trend towards leaning the combustion as much as possible and increasing the compression ratio

Does this mean I am finally vindicated from our arguments of long ago?

[WhiteBlue]

WB said

There is certainly a trend towards leaning the combustion as much as possible and increasing the compression ratio

Does this mean I am finally vindicated from our arguments of long ago?

I have no idea what you are talking about. Care to provide a quotation?

[matt21]

Can anybody help me understanding this article?

5.3.5 The entire power unit (with the exception of the items listed in Article 5.3.8 ) must be installed between two vertical planes normal to the car centre line separated by 700mm or in a box 150mm long, 250mm wide and 800mm high which lies symmetrically about the car centre line immediately ahead of the front vertical plane.

I can understand from the first part of the sentence that the power unit has to be not longer than 700mm.
But what does the secon part with the box mean?

[rjsa]

I understood something like this:

The red planes limit the turbo axis position. The green planes and the blue box are the ones mentioned by you.

The 500 purple plan, if I remember right since this was done long ago, positions the gearbox/engine interface.

[matt21]

The problem is, that it says "between the two planes" OR "in the box".

Also I understood that the turbo axis can be placed anywhere as long as it is within 50mm from the center plane.

[rjsa]

The two red planes mark the region 50mm from the center plane.

The space between the two green planes in addition to the blue box could hold the engine, turbo and kers motor. Or whatever is attached to the engine and hangs outside the engine/tube fitting interface.

If you look at the shape of that blue box, it is designed to hold something just like that: the kers motor or the turbo hanging from the forward plane of the engine

[strad]

WB..How quickly you forget.

[PhillipM]

here's my prediction.

I've gone for a slightly optimistic guess at the absolute torque value - given DI should improve it over the current figures (about 110-115lb ft per litre IIRC), and the reduced rpm range should lead to slightly better cylinder filling low down, but I'd imagine it'd end up closer to this myself:




Although they'll probably around ~30lbft lower initially.

[WhiteBlue]

WB..How quickly you forget.

Or how readily you are making things up. Do the honourable thing and show me a quotation. I will answer all you questions and remarks then. Making unfounded accusations is bad style and reflects poorely on your ability to lead a fair discussion. A troll can make bold statements without proof. To be taken serious you need to do better.

[WhiteBlue]

The power curve lookes ok for me. Power should peak at 10.500 rpm and go down from there very slightly.

I very much doubt that drivers will regularly use the rev band up to 15.000.