Mercedes GP W02

[dren]

More on the suspension here:

http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2011/10/1 ... uspension/

Good write up scarbs. Is Red Bull running something similar?

[bonjon1979]

As marcush correctly wrote, testing tiny ducting in scale model in wind tunnel does not give reliable results. You need 1:1 testing to evaluate that.

CFD? I am not sure what kind of fludic switch they are using (if they are using any), but if it works with turbuklent transition cfd also may be erratic.

I think its within the rules if full scale models of just the FW+ tires are tested (F1 parts/part combination)..but would not give a complete picture of the effect..

Teams can opt to have a few hours (4 I think) full scale wind tunnel tests instead of a days straightline testing. I'm not sure if they'd make a full model either, rather just use the actual car as the basis and maybe model some parts that aren't in production yet.

[yener]

Guys, correct me if i'm wrong but isnt it remarkable that Mercedes didn't change their rear wing?
As far as i know they never updated, only once in Italy where they set the car up for high top speed.
McLaren and Ferrari both revised the rearwings.

Wouldn't it be logical to the issues they have to work on the rear wing?
They don't have enough grip at the rear we all know that. We also know they have done some work on the rear suspension, but it doesnt make sense why they only have worked on the front wing.

[MIKEY_!]

I agree it seems like a logical area for improvement since they lack rear DF (among other things but you've got to start somewhere)I'd have thought they'd go for a longer chord DRS but it must be less efficient on this car????

[yener]

Sorry that my english is so bad but i'm gonna try it.

If the rear wing would be bigger (or the drs flap) in terms of "catching" more air. It would also produce more DF. With a smaller one just like they used in Itally it will give them more topspeed (straightline).

It would be really logical to me, to modify the rearwing asap.

The rear end is the side which is importent for the confidence of the drivers, doesnt it?

This just keeps running circles in my mind for the last hours.

[raymondu999]

If the rear wing would be bigger (or the drs flap) in terms of "catching" more air. It would also produce more DF. With a smaller one just like they used in Itally it will give them more topspeed (straightline).

Depends. Maybe their rear wing design gives more lap time the way it is now. Maybe if you changed to a bigger flap; the downforce gain is less than the speed loss.

The rear end is the side which is importent for the confidence of the drivers, doesnt it?.

Again it depends on the driver. Some drivers like Button or Webber gain confidence from a steady rear; but some like Hamilton/Vettel gain confidence from a strong front

[MIKEY_!]

It all comes down to efficiency really. And balance. We know Schumacher likes a sharp front end, not sure about Rosberg but then he's not the number 1 driver.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

It all comes down to efficiency really. And balance. We know Schumacher likes a sharp front end, not sure about Rosberg but then he's not the number 1 driver.

And nor is Schumacher.
Rosberg actually likes the car "pointy"...exactly as Schumacher. The only caveat is HOW pointy.

[MIKEY_!]

Sorry that's what i meant, schuy likes a really pointy front. Most drivers like a sharp front end I'd say but some more than others.

[Adamski]

Rosberg actually likes the car "pointy"...exactly as Schumacher. The only caveat is HOW pointy.

Sorry that's what i meant, schuy likes a really pointy front. Most drivers like a sharp front end I'd say but some more than others.

Sorry guys, could you describe to me a pointy car? How does it feel, when you drive a pointy car?
All I can see is that the W02 much more sensible to steering than its predecessor. In my words, it is much more over-steered. It is the same effect, when you have a pointy car?

[Richard]

I'm not sure over steer is the same as "pointy".

Pointy to me means the car has a sharp front end balanced with the back so it can turn in quickly without the back end sliding out. The turning motion matches the steering input.

Oversteer is when the sharp front end turns in but the back end slides out. Hence the turning motion is greater than the steering input.

So both types result in a car that is turning tight corners, but the sliding rear ruins the back tyres. I suspect an oversteer car turning on the same radius as a "pointy" car can't get on the power as quickly because the rear doesn't have full traction?

Of course the advantage of oversteer is that it usually gives you a car that can steer tighter radius than one that remains in balance. In that case you straighten earlier and get power down earlier. That advantage compensates for rear sliding around.

I suspect that oversteer is more punishing with the Pirelli tyres as they require more intelligent use than the bomb proof, last all race with all guns blazing every lap Bridgestone tyres?

[beelsebob]

I'm not sure over steer is the same as "pointy".

Pointy to me means the car has a sharp front end balanced with the back so it can turn in quickly without the back end sliding out. The turning motion matches the steering input.

Oversteer is when the sharp front end turns in but the back end slides out. Hence the turning motion is greater than the steering input.

So both types result in a car that is turning tight corners, but the sliding rear ruins the back tyres. I suspect an oversteer car turning on the same radius as a "pointy" car can't get on the power as quickly because the rear doesn't have full traction?

Of course the advantage of oversteer is that it usually gives you a car that can steer tighter radius than one that remains in balance. In that case you straighten earlier and get power down earlier. That advantage compensates for rear sliding around.

I suspect that oversteer is more punishing with the Pirelli tyres as they require more intelligent use than the bomb proof, last all race with all guns blazing every lap Bridgestone tyres?

Indeed, pointy implies good front grip, oversteer implies poor rear grip. The two often come together, but they don't have to.

[Mr.S]

Well MSC does not really prefer a short wheel base,he always prefers a longer wheel-base which gives him more choices for set-up & he feels more comfortable in it.

Mercedes are not really desinging their car around anybody,I am inclined to say both receive fairly equal treatment,Mercedes will do nothing to really upset Nico because they see Nico around whom the team will probably be build in the next few years.

[yener]

Still IMO it's stupid to work for a pointy front, while the rear is shaky .

I think they will surprise us with a new rear wing on the w03.

[wesley123]

Still IMO it's stupid to work for a pointy front, while the rear is shaky .

I think they will surprise us with a new rear wing on the w03.

Why is it stupid? if both drivers like a pointy front end it is already logical to go that way, plus an oversteering car is easier to drive around track than an understeering one