Brazilian GP 2011 - Interlagos

[kalinka]

I don't know how much short shifting reduces lap time, but if your driver constantly putting fast lap after fast lap + a best lap AFTER you warned him he has a SERIOUS gearbox problem, I bet you would shout on the radio constantly. They stated after the race that they didn't know when that gearbox will fail. It was very unnecessary risk to take if that problem was real. Even if Vettel was in danger from Alonso, but we know he wasn't. I just can't find a real explanation for the team's reactions. We know Vettel sometimes freaks off and puts fast laps at the end of the race just for fun, but this wasn't the same situation IMHO.
Anyway, we should finish this thread once, so I'm off here

[Richard]

I was waiting for this moment for a few races. It was inevitable once Horner said something like "now Vettel has the WDC we'll do whatever we can to get a win for Webber."

I also thought Hamilton was being told about his gearbox by McLaren to ensure Button came 2nd. I though the gearbox excuse showed a good sense of humour, until it turned out to be true.

It would certainly have kept fans happy who want their team to copy everything RB do!

[Mandrake]

It would certainly have kept fans happy who want their team to copy everything RB do!

Big smile on my face now

[raymondu999]

I'm not a big fan of Peter Windsor, as he does come across as very heavily biased towards Mark Webber at times; but anyways;
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HerQCVwpX2A[/youtube]

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

How man times have you tweeted Peter windsor calling him "mate" ray?

[raymondu999]

How man times have you tweeted Peter windsor calling him "mate" ray?

He has some good stuff at times; and he's a very eloquent writer I must say. His writing style is very story-like in his race reports. However he does come across as a Webber fanboy, and I would never trust him on technical issues as he posts many gaffes there. Such as when he said that the harder a tyre is; the less advantage more downforce gives. And how he keeps on rambling about saying that you have to keep a car straight on the exit of a corner, apparently "draining" the engine of "g-load."

He muddles up driving styles too. He said of Sutil a while back that "you will never see Sutil doing a wide entry, late apex style. His style is turn in early, get the car straightened up for the exit early, and on the power nice and early." which kind of doesn't make any sense

I say "mate" so he doesn't shrug my tweet away

[ell66]

wasnt impressed by jenson, alonso showed him up on the first stint,

Then Button "showed up" Alonso on the final stint. So that's quits?

The thing is that Button finished first of the non-RB in both the race and the WDC. You may not be impressed by his style, but he does bring in the results.

Nice try, but hardly the same when the mclaren was a whole second if not more faster than the ferrari on the prime tyre, fact is on the softs alonso made the difference and showed him up, he was defenseless on the harder compound.

[beelsebob]

wasnt impressed by jenson, alonso showed him up on the first stint,

Then Button "showed up" Alonso on the final stint. So that's quits?

The thing is that Button finished first of the non-RB in both the race and the WDC. You may not be impressed by his style, but he does bring in the results.

Nice try, but hardly the same when the mclaren was a whole second if not more faster than the ferrari on the prime tyre, fact is on the softs alonso made the difference and showed him up, he was defenseless on the harder compound.

So what you're saying is... Button and Hamilton both slower than Alonso on soft tyres == Alonso making the difference; Button faster than Alonso on hard tyres == McLaren making the difference? Showing your bias at all?

[Mandrake]

It's not a real bias is it? It is well known the Ferrari is rubbish on the harder compound. So when Alonso passed Button in the beginning of the race, he was overperforming in the Ferrari as the McLaren was the faster car in general.

Button being able to overtake Alonso at the end of the race was just the Ferrari not losing 1 sec/lap on the hards but significantly more, changing the balance of power favourably to McLaren!

[beelsebob]

It's not a real bias is it? It is well known the Ferrari is rubbish on the harder compound. So when Alonso passed Button in the beginning of the race, he was overperforming in the Ferrari as the McLaren was the faster car in general.

Button being able to overtake Alonso at the end of the race was just the Ferrari not losing 1 sec/lap on the hards but significantly more, changing the balance of power favourably to McLaren!

It's also well known that the McLaren drivers couldn't find a ballance on the Soft compound, so when Alonso passed button in the beginning of the race he was simply passing a driver struggling on tyres. You should note especially that Button was going faster on the hards than hamilton was on the softs at the same point in the race.

The bias is that you're admitting mitigating factors for the driver you're biased towards, but not for the other.

[Donuts]

Alonso's advantage on the soft tires was much less than Button's advantage on the medium tires(no matter if Button was struggling or not):

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/wp-conten ... .34.53.png

Alonso's takeover(which curve was it now again) was much harder to perform than Button's takeover(DRS-straight). Button blame's debri from Schumacher's car was in his way.

[beelsebob]

Alonso's advantage on the soft tires was much less than Button's advantage on the medium tires(no matter if Button was struggling or not):

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/wp-conten ... .34.53.png

Alonso's takeover(which curve was it now again) was much harder to perform than Button's takeover(DRS-straight). Button blame's debri from Schumacher's car was in his way.

I'm not convinced Alonso's advantage on the soft tyres was as small as you made out – in both incidents, Button was driving "qualifying laps" – in other words, Alonso was able to stick with Button and crawl all over him even with the front wing having reduced down force, and even with Button putting in as fast a lap as he possibly could.

Alonso's pass certainly was impressive, but I still don't buy that Alonso somehow embarrassed button with it, or that button somehow embarrassed Alonso later. The bottom line is that they both passed each other, at points when each other's car was faster.

[Donuts]

Alonso's advantage on the soft tires was much less than Button's advantage on the medium tires(no matter if Button was struggling or not):

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/wp-conten ... .34.53.png

Alonso's takeover(which curve was it now again) was much harder to perform than Button's takeover(DRS-straight). Button blame's debri from Schumacher's car was in his way.

I'm not convinced Alonso's advantage on the soft tyres was as small as you made out – in both incidents, Button was driving "qualifying laps" – in other words, Alonso was able to stick with Button and crawl all over him even with the front wing having reduced down force, and even with Button putting in as fast a lap as he possibly could.

Alonso's pass certainly was impressive, but I still don't buy that Alonso somehow embarrassed button with it, or that button somehow embarrassed Alonso later. The bottom line is that they both passed each other, at points when each other's car was faster.

I must have missed something? I thought the discussion was simply about who was better in the race(hence my motivation to my choice)? I never said anything about anyone embarrasing anyone. I think you are misstaking me for ell66.

[Mr Alcatraz]

Neither showed up or embarrassed the other. Alonso as usual drove the 150 to its limit. The 150 has been significantly faster proportionally on heavy tanks, and is downright competitive until about 1/3 of its fuel is burned off. For some mysterious reason the MP4-26 in Buttons hands had trouble with grip on the options which here to fore this season was not an issue for him (as far as I know). He made the adjustment to primes and found the grip. It was just a matter of time before Alonso had to go on to the primes which allowed Button to close, line him up, and pass him like he was standing still.

[Mr Alcatraz]

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