2012 Stalled wings, F/ W ducts & DDRS

[dren]

If the front wing stalls, I would think you would want it to reattach as soon as possible once you start to brake. Perhaps the DRS coupled f-duct is a way for the driver to control this. There were rumblings that both drivers didn't like the f-duct front wing last year due to balance issues. Maybe they solved that.

[MercAMGF1Fans]

Really can't wait to see if the drivers will be able to use DRS through the corners (Coupled with the Front-Wing W-Duct).. would be really something if they can achieve that level of balance

[raymondu999]

Even then they'd only be able to go through corners with DRS; that they're traveling flat out through anyways.

[MercAMGF1Fans]

so high speed corners only?

[raymondu999]

Why on earth would you go through a slow corner with DRS? That would be stupidity. You would only EVER open the DRS when you have more than enough rear grip.

I think the balance help would be marginal to be honest. The Red Bulls still had the DRS open for the last quarter of Turn 3 Barcelona - and Webber still could have DRS open all the way through new Abbey and the first left and right at Maggotts and Becketts - even with the quick direction change. He had it open all the way through the Schumacher S too. It could be just the Red Bull was crazy; but it could be that it's not as big a thing as people big up.

[Richard]

There are a lot of post clogging up the car threads with debating the possibility of stalled wings, along with F and W ducts.

Those posts will be moved into this thread.

[WhiteBlue]

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 68262.html
German AMuS article from March 9th kicking off much speculation by saying that secondary use F-duct activation by daisy chaining it to the DRS actuator will be legal.

http://smallblogv8.blogspot.com/2012/02 ... -ugly.html

W03 Front wing system with invisible blowing gaps under the wing.




Suspected rear wing with blown gap. It is thought that the air is fed through the end plates.


And here we see that the engine cover is connected with the bottom wing element which itself is connected to the end plates. The mysterious holes could be the air intakes.

[hardingfv32]

1) What is demonstrated need for an DRS signaled F-duct system? How does the DRS signal coordinate with your desired outcome? It is my claim that no benefit can be delineated.

2) Considering the implication of air flow in ducts, the front or rear routing schemes have not the slightest chance of delivering a useful flow to the wing surface. Look at the old McLaren F-duct and note how large and straight it was required to be to function properly.

Brian

[Richard]

I see scarbs has sketched out a possible method for the W duct

http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2012/03/1 ... -wing-drs/

I thought all wings needed to be closed section, but Scarbs says this only applies to the rear wing.

[Pup]

If he's saying that the air from the rear wing is what's blowing the front wing, then I'd say it's a bit pie in the sky. But if he's saying that the air is being used to trigger a flap or valve of some sort, then maybe.

But my main problem with the idea of blown front wings is that the main plane of the front wing - the only one that could be blown, doesn't have a particularly high angle of attack. So I don't really know how a) you could stall it, and b) if it would really matter.

I mean, the rear wings on these cars have a massive aoa, so the benefits of blowing are obvious - but the front wing? Maybe if you could stall the upper elements, but I don't see how it's possible to blow those.

I'd be more inclined to believe that this system would work in conjunction with something along the lines of what smickle is suggesting about manipulating vortexes.

[WhiteBlue]

What Charlie had to say about the Merc system:

At the beginning of last year, with engineers being unable to unlearn things, they wanted to try and get the effect via different means, and they talked about opening and closing a duct by having interaction with the suspension. We said no, you cannot do that because that is not the primary purpose of the suspension system which is to insulate the car from undulations in the road.

There was then a lengthy discussion in the TWG at the beginning of last year about that, to make sure everyone was clear about it. It seems a couple of teams went away from that meeting with the impression that F-ducts were banned in general. Whatever an F-duct is. But they are not.

What it appears some teams are doing is that when the DRS is operated, it will allow air to pass into a duct and do other things. That is all I can say you will probably have a pretty good idea of what it might be doing, and other teams will as well. But it is completely passive. There are no moving parts in it; it doesn't interact with any suspension. No steering, nothing. Therefore I cannot see a rule that prohibits it.

[ecapox]

So based on that clip from Charlie, i could make a system where, when the DRS is activated, all the front wing flaps flatten themselves to reduce drag enve further.

they wanted to try and get the effect via different means, and they talked about opening and closing a duct by having interaction with the suspension. We said no, you cannot do that because that is not the primary purpose of the suspension system which is to insulate the car from undulations in the road.

The DRS system is activating SOMETHING. which is not it's primary purpose. Whether that is a switch or uncovering a hole or something else, it's primary objective is to reduce drag on the rear wing. If it does ANYTHING else, then it is going against the primary purpose of the DRS. Just like his statement on the suspension.

[WhiteBlue]

So based on that clip from Charlie, i could make a system where, when the DRS is activated, all the front wing flaps flatten themselves to reduce drag enve further...

You may do so unless the particular system is prohibited by other means and regulations. AFAIK movable elements of front wings are absolutely prohibited. So your interpretation isn't legal IMO.

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Mercedes ducting system opening


image via F1Talks.pl

[munudeges]

Don't see how this can be legal if it is operated by the DRS.