Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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ginge101
ginge101
0
Joined: 04 Mar 2012, 15:17

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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xpensive wrote:
thestig84 wrote: ...
Ill be interested to hear from BBCs 'Expert' Gary Anderson. He seems to have taken issue with the 27 since launch...Nose a mistake (he even said they realised so removed snow plough, rubbish), undercut the wrong shape and didnt rate exhaust concept. I hope he admits he was wrong.
Gary Anderson is to my mind xtremely overrated, he's not an engineer and has had difficulties working with computers,
his career is in many ways thanks to his relationship with MrE, when he started out as a Brabham mechanic in the early 70s.

The MP4-27 is a gem.
Totally agree everything he has said has come back as he was wrong.

GrizzleBoy
GrizzleBoy
33
Joined: 05 Mar 2012, 04:06

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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Diesel wrote:
xpensive wrote:
thestig84 wrote: ...
Ill be interested to hear from BBCs 'Expert' Gary Anderson. He seems to have taken issue with the 27 since launch...Nose a mistake (he even said they realised so removed snow plough, rubbish), undercut the wrong shape and didnt rate exhaust concept. I hope he admits he was wrong.
Gary Anderson is to my mind xtremely overrated, he's not an engineer and has had difficulties working with computers,
his career is in many ways thanks to his relationship with MrE, when he started out as a Brabham mechanic in the early 70s.

The MP4-27 is a gem.
This was also complete drivel:-
http://www1.skysports.com/formula-1/new ... The-MP4-27

I swear, where do they find these ill informed idiots?
Just as bad as the people on this website who assumed McLarens front end was bad because it wasn't like everyone elses, and assumed the back end was bad because it wasn't like Red Bulls.

Still, race pace and ability to manage the tyres is a different thing altogether.

The race could still go in any direction and we don't really know how hard Hamilton pushed his tyres to get those fast laps.

Hamilton had a tendency to kill his tyres quickly last season. Maybe the new tyres will allow aggressive driving to exist on the track, as well as "careful coasting" this time around.

Then again, Button was about 0.158s behind him and is known for his smooth driving. Could mean he benefits more in the long run.

We shall see.


I do have to wonder how much of any of the performance we have seen so far has to do with exhausts though and if this could be testament to the MP4-27s system. Or is it most likely the car on the whole?

aduka11
aduka11
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Joined: 17 Feb 2012, 14:29

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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xpensive wrote:
thestig84 wrote: ...
Ill be interested to hear from BBCs 'Expert' Gary Anderson. He seems to have taken issue with the 27 since launch...Nose a mistake (he even said they realised so removed snow plough, rubbish), undercut the wrong shape and didnt rate exhaust concept. I hope he admits he was wrong.
Gary Anderson is to my mind xtremely overrated, he's not an engineer and has had difficulties working with computers,
his career is in many ways thanks to his relationship with MrE, when he started out as a Brabham mechanic in the early 70s.

The MP4-27 is a gem.
Actually Gary is a great car developer...In 1999 Jordan...with limited resources..he was able to win 2 races and take 1 pole...

I would believe this guy far more than Scrabs...since he was a main desiger of one F1 team..and was right about Ferrari from the first time he saw the car..

This man knows his job.

kilcoo316
kilcoo316
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Joined: 09 Mar 2005, 16:45
Location: Kilcoo, Ireland

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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I think it shows just how much being quick in F1 is about detail (unless you've a fundamental problem).

We can sit here and spout off, a number of us are very knowledgeable and probably very good at what we do. Yet, essentially, we can quantify nothing by looking at a photo. The best we can do is determine what they are trying to do, and even then, we have disagreements.


Gary Anderson has designed (or had a hand in) 4 race winning cars. I know his aerodynamics reputation is not great, but he still has vastly more experience in designing the things than anyone here. He is by far the most knowledgeable of the journalists commenting on car designs. Despite this, he is no different from us and cannot quantify performance from a photo.




The McLaren is incredibly well detailed.
Bob Bell spent the guts of last year improving the detail on the Merc = P4 in qual.
Ferrari, new concept, still needs detail added = nowhere, there may even be fundamental problems there.
Renault, always a strong aero team which screwed the pooch last year with the front exhausts, still great detail on the car = P3.


The devil is in the details; yet we cannot quantify any of it at all!

murtoidf1
murtoidf1
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Joined: 10 Sep 2010, 12:58

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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aduka11 wrote: Actually Gary is a great car developer...In 1999 Jordan...with limited resources..he was able to win 2 races and take 1 pole...

I would believe this guy far more than Scrabs...since he was a main desiger of one F1 team..and was right about Ferrari from the first time he saw the car..

This man knows his job.
He knew his job. At the moment he seem's to be rubbishing any design that isn't a RB design, as well as saying Mclaren have made a "mistake" when even people on here said it's impossible to know as they're a big team with big resources and have obviously decided on a different approach..

as it happens coming pole in the first race proves him wrong.

xpensive
xpensive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2008, 18:06
Location: Somewhere in Scandinavia

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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aduka11 wrote: ...
Actually Gary is a great car developer...In 1999 Jordan...with limited resources..he was able to win 2 races and take 1 pole...
...
This man knows his job.
Wrong on all counts I'm afraid, the 1999 Jordan was all Mike Gascoyne's work, during 1998 -2000 Anderson was busy designing shitboxes for Stewart/Jaguar, then back to Jordan for 2002 - 2003 to design a couple of more shitboxes.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

aduka11
aduka11
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Joined: 17 Feb 2012, 14:29

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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xpensive wrote:
aduka11 wrote: ...
Actually Gary is a great car developer...In 1999 Jordan...with limited resources..he was able to win 2 races and take 1 pole...
...
This man knows his job.
Wrong on all counts I'm afraid, the 1999 Jordan was all Mike Gascoyne's work, during 1998 -2000 Anderson was busy designing shitboxes for Stewart/Jaguar, then back to Jordan for 2002 - 2003 to design a couple of more shitboxes.
OKay my bad...

Still they finished 4th in Constructors in 1998.

User avatar
siskue2005
70
Joined: 11 May 2007, 21:50

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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aduka11 wrote:
xpensive wrote:
thestig84 wrote: ...
Ill be interested to hear from BBCs 'Expert' Gary Anderson. He seems to have taken issue with the 27 since launch...Nose a mistake (he even said they realised so removed snow plough, rubbish), undercut the wrong shape and didnt rate exhaust concept. I hope he admits he was wrong.
Gary Anderson is to my mind xtremely overrated, he's not an engineer and has had difficulties working with computers,
his career is in many ways thanks to his relationship with MrE, when he started out as a Brabham mechanic in the early 70s.

The MP4-27 is a gem.
Actually Gary is a great car developer...In 1999 Jordan...with limited resources..he was able to win 2 races and take 1 pole...

I would believe this guy far more than Scrabs...since he was a main desiger of one F1 team..and was right about Ferrari from the first time he saw the car..

This man knows his job.
yeah right, if you watch star sports coverage in 2011 you would know that Gary was just a full of cr@p :lol:

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Joined: 12 Mar 2006, 00:27
Location: ...

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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Mclaren now stripping the car down in front of the FIA. This doesn't look good.
UPDATE: It looks like the cars have been released, but the FIA spent a long time looking at the McLaren.

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AdrianoZed
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Joined: 17 Mar 2012, 11:12

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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This season looks like it will be very close for the top 4 teams, Mclaren is a beauty.
I keep laughing at the people that kept saying the Mclaren nose is wrong and that they missed a trick, when in fact all the nay sayers missed the fact that Mclaren have been running with the low-nose concept for a long time now and they did not have to alter their nose design philosophy because of the rule changes.
Hoping Hamilton and Macca takes the Championship this year, in my oppinion they deserve a constructors championship.
Ayrton Senna "If you no longer go for a gap that exists, you are no longer a racing driver"
Racing is life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting." Steve McQueen

thestig84
thestig84
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Joined: 19 Nov 2009, 13:09

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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Diesel wrote:
Mclaren now stripping the car down in front of the FIA. This doesn't look good.
I follow the guy hat tweeted that. He has since said the cars have come back from FIA checks

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silversurf3r
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Joined: 20 Oct 2011, 14:12

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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thestig84 wrote:
Diesel wrote:
Mclaren now stripping the car down in front of the FIA. This doesn't look good.
I follow the guy hat tweeted that. He has since said the cars have come back from FIA checks
From the BBC:
McLaren had some nervous moments after qualifying when governing body the FIA spent three and a half hours checking their car to ensure it complied with the rules.

There was some concern about the height of the front wing, but it was eventually cleared.
Interesting, not seen any photo's showing the -27 nose particularly low. Good news all has been cleared though.

murtoidf1
murtoidf1
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Joined: 10 Sep 2010, 12:58

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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I'm quite happy that Gary Anderson's "technical Analysis" has already been proven wrong.

If i remember rightly he described Red Bull's new exhaust package as " innovative" when it was just their version of the Sauber and Merc system.

He also said McLaren were missing a trick with the low nose..

I honestly think this is probably the most informed/unbiased source of information on the internet besides scarbs

King Six
King Six
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Joined: 27 May 2008, 16:52
Location: London, England

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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Hmm, I wonder if the this car has something tricky that nobody has spotted yet, that the FIA only spotted after qualifying scrutineering or whatever it is.

You don't just hold a car for hours longer because you're unsure about the height of the front wing, surely there's more to it than that!

murtoidf1
murtoidf1
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Joined: 10 Sep 2010, 12:58

Re: Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

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King Six wrote:Hmm, I wonder if the this car has something tricky that nobody has spotted yet, that the FIA only spotted after qualifying scrutineering or whatever it is.

You don't just hold a car for hours longer because you're unsure about the height of the front wing, surely there's more to it than that!
After Hamilton set that lap that was around 7 tenths faster, Ross Brawn walked away from the pit wall and went into the garage, I wonder if he saw something or if that prompted something to happen