Vodafone McLaren MP4-27 Mercedes

[N12ck]

Because of parc ferme rules it would be illegal to make any changes to the car between quali and race right??

So you couldnt use the DRS with front wing stalling during quali and then block the tunnel that leads to the front wing before race??

What if you made a mechanism that that only unblocked the front wing tunnel when the fuel levels are low? It could relativly easy be done.

Then the front wing DRS would only work during quali where fuel levels are low and in the last few laps of the race. Wouldnt that be a benefit?? I have been thinking that the front wing stalling mechanism makes the car to instabile when the car is full of fuel??

Whats your thoughts on this idea?

well I don't think there is much point, the FW Fduct is activated when DRS is open in the race and quali, so for quali its great, but in the race you will only use it if within 1 second of the guy infront, so i cant see anything but an advantage having it, if you blocked off the tunnel for the race you wouldnt be able to overtake as easy with DRS, so I think it has pros for the race and quali

[Holm86]

But lets say the car has 120 kg of extra weight in fuel. So within the first laps you close in on the guy in front of you. You are now allowed to use DRS. But instead of just sheadding drag it also makes the car very unstabile if you activate it in a corner. All im saying is that if you block off the tunnel to the front wing only when the car is heavy with fuel then the car wont be unstabile if you activate it in a corner. DRS zones dosnt only cover straights right?

[N12ck]

But lets say the car has 120 kg of extra weight in fuel. So within the first laps you close in on the guy in front of you. You are now allowed to use DRS. But instead of just sheadding drag it also makes the car very unstabile if you activate it in a corner. All im saying is that if you block off the tunnel to the front wing only when the car is heavy with fuel then the car wont be unstabile if you activate it in a corner. DRS zones dosnt only cover straights right?

DRS zones are only on straights, so it would be pointless, and you only get 1 or 2 DRS zones, both on straights, so when the wing is shut you have no drag reduction so you wont have instability in corners, when it is open (when you are overtaking) it can only give drag reduction advantage, which is all good

[Holm86]

Okay. I just believed to remember that some DRS zones included some slight bends.

[N12ck]

Okay. I just believed to remember that some DRS zones included some slight bends.

slight bends, but more drag reduction would be an advantage as the levels or downforce needed arent that big, so the drag reduction to get the top end would be worth more laptime than preventing any slight instability it may give which IMO would be negligible, I believe the DRS duct advantages outweighs its disadvantages

[ianwit]

im kind of hoping McLaren dont bother with the DRS duct as i think it is the root of Mercedes poor race performance!

care to explain ?

Ditto, you could just as easily say it would help the McLaren as the whole package is better. It should be easier to simulate in the wind tunnel based on the knowledge base they have from testing and 2 races.

[Pandabeer]

I also think the F-duct is only a positive device, and i don't think that the W03 is that much unbalanced while they activate DRS relative to using DRS without a F-duct. When they activate DRS it stalls the rear-wing and the front-wing simultaneously, so i guess this will be well balanced together. What i do not know is, how much of an advantage this system provides. The top-speed at the end of the straights with the W03 isn't that much faster then other teams e.g Lotus or McLaren, but it might provide you a good advantage while accelerating out of slow corners. I wouldn't be surprised to see McLaren/Red Bull/Lotus with a F-duct within the next races.

[raymondu999]

To be honest looking at Schumacher's qualifying onboards, he still opens the DRS later than the Red Bulls/McLarens it seems. He pretty much waits until he only has max 5 degrees of lock on. Could it be just a massive drag reduction rather than any special front wing trickery?

[AnthonyG]

Because of parc ferme rules it would be illegal to make any changes to the car between quali and race right??

So you couldnt use the DRS with front wing stalling during quali and then block the tunnel that leads to the front wing before race??

What if you made a mechanism that that only unblocked the front wing tunnel when the fuel levels are low? It could relativly easy be done.

Then the front wing DRS would only work during quali where fuel levels are low and in the last few laps of the race. Wouldnt that be a benefit?? I have been thinking that the front wing stalling mechanism makes the car to instabile when the car is full of fuel??

Whats your thoughts on this idea?

Too complicated.

I don't believe it's implemented like you say, but if they want, they can always block a channel with a piece of tape or something like that. No problem at all and much easier and cheaper than some complicated system.

[adrianjordan]

Because of parc ferme rules it would be illegal to make any changes to the car between quali and race right??

So you couldnt use the DRS with front wing stalling during quali and then block the tunnel that leads to the front wing before race??

What if you made a mechanism that that only unblocked the front wing tunnel when the fuel levels are low? It could relativly easy be done.

Then the front wing DRS would only work during quali where fuel levels are low and in the last few laps of the race. Wouldnt that be a benefit?? I have been thinking that the front wing stalling mechanism makes the car to instabile when the car is full of fuel??

Whats your thoughts on this idea?

+1

Doesn't Parc Ferme end the minute the cars go to the grid?? So in theory they could block it off then...
Too complicated.

I don't believe it's implemented like you say, but if they want, they can always block a channel with a piece of tape or something like that. No problem at all and much easier and cheaper than some complicated system.

[morefirejules08]

im kind of hoping McLaren dont bother with the DRS duct as i think it is the root of Mercedes poor race performance!

care to explain ?

i think Mercedes are overly reliant on the system, I think they set the car up around the DRS/duct system which gives them a great set up in practice and quali when DRS can be used at any time but when it comes to the race there set up is wrong, leading to excessive tyre wear

[beelsebob]

im kind of hoping McLaren dont bother with the DRS duct as i think it is the root of Mercedes poor race performance!

care to explain ?

i think Mercedes are overly reliant on the system, I think they set the car up around the DRS/duct system which gives them a great set up in practice and quali when DRS can be used at any time but when it comes to the race there set up is wrong, leading to excessive tyre wear

I disagree... If you imagine McLaren (who already have a qualifying advantage) using this system, the first thing they would do is immediately set up their cars for the race, because they know they have 0.5 seconds in hand (over and above the advantage they already have) in qualifying. This would allow McLaren to focus pretty much purely on race pace, and still dominate qualifying.

With this in mind, I really don't see how it can be seen as the "root of poor race performance".

[Shakeman]

I agree. Merc's problems appear to be tyre related and not sure how the drs/f duct can be blamed.

[myurr]

Depends if they have to set the gearing up to take advantage of the DRS / F-duct and that then compromises their race pace by giving them the wrong gearing when DRS and the duct are not active.

[e30ernest]

Depends if they have to set the gearing up to take advantage of the DRS / F-duct and that then compromises their race pace by giving them the wrong gearing when DRS and the duct are not active.

Unlikely. If I recall correctly, their top speed seems to suggest they are geared similarly to other teams.