Ferrari F2012

[banibhusan]

Well according to sources on twitter, they are still working on the launch spec exhaust and have sped up the development process (obviously a well calculated speculation from credible sources). So we might still see a modified launch spec version in Bahrain.

As many people speculated earlier that Ferrari is working on both the launch spec and the Sauber spec exhaust, so it's a possibility that Ferrari may come up with the launch spec at Bahrain and the Sauber spec at Mugello and compare which one is working the best for the car.

On the contrary, Pat Fry during the Chinese GP weekend told to reporters that Ferrari has only small updates planned for Bahrain. So it's still quite a mystery what they really are planning to do. It'll be clear once we come to Thursday.

Unlikely. The quoted reason that the launch exhausts didn't work out is that they were overheating the rear tyres.

That's the whole purpose, right? If they can solve the tyre overheating issue with the launch exhaust, i.e. if the exhaust work as originally intended to, then why wouldn't they run it in Bahrain?

[myurr]

Unlikely. The quoted reason that the launch exhausts didn't work out is that they were overheating the rear tyres.

That's the whole purpose, right? If they can solve the tyre overheating issue with the launch exhaust, i.e. if the exhaust work as originally intended to, then why wouldn't they run it in Bahrain?

My response was to someone who said they had nothing to lose by running the launch spec.

If they can modify it to not overheat the tyre then I'm sure they'll run it. The problem is that their original simulations were obviously unable to detect that problem, so it won't be as simple as them just shifting components around a bit. They'll be having to improve their test and simulation software etc. in order to be able to replicate the real world, then make the subtle changes to fix the problem, then refine the system, then get it manufactured. That's a heck of a lead time.

[banibhusan]

If they can modify it to not overheat the tyre then I'm sure they'll run it. The problem is that their original simulations were obviously unable to detect that problem, so it won't be as simple as them just shifting components around a bit. They'll be having to improve their test and simulation software etc. in order to be able to replicate the real world, then make the subtle changes to fix the problem, then refine the system, then get it manufactured. That's a heck of a lead time.

Agreed!! Even Fry suggested that Ferrari needs a lot of changes in the aero department. So what you said may also be a part of that development process which will take time. I hope with their major raft of updates for Spain, they can close the gap to the front running teams even more.

[alogoc]

any one has a quote from Domenicali sayin about exhaust for Bahrein?

[Vanja #66]

According to Serbian motorsport media, Scuderia is on route for DoubleDRS development... Fry says that after FIA's decision to turn down Lotus' latest protest, team will probably speed up it's development.

"Razmišljamo o tome već neko vreme, i sve se svodi na ocenu koliki dobitak u preformansama sistem može da nam donese. Ne radi se samo o tome da primenimo DDRS na našu već postojeću aerodinamičku konfiguraciju - ako to već uradimo, onda moramo i da imamo opipljive koristi od toga. To nije teško utvrditi kada se sistem primeni, jednostavno se pogledaju vremena po krugu. Ipak, moramo da vodimo računa o tome koliki je krajni potencijal sistema. Posle odluke FIA da je sistem legalan, svakako ćemo ubrzati rad na razvoju DDRS sistema", rekao je Fry.

Link: http://www.f1-serbia.com/najnovije/ferr ... drs-sistem

Translation:

"We've been thinking about it for some time, and it all comes down to judgement of how much performance gain is there. It's not just about applying DDRS on our already existing aerodynamic configuration - if we are to do it, we must have some considerable gain from it. It's not hard to determine that when system is in use, you simply take a look into lap times. However, we must take its terminal potential into account. After FIA decision that the system is legal, we'll certainly speed up our work on DDRS system." says Fry

I hope they are not getting stretched out too much, cause this is serious development, and will definitely require new chassis, if I'm not mistaken...

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Here's what the update for Mugello/Spain might look like? I think the Acer Ducts may be history.

[raymondu999]

Looks like a big rework. I'm very interested in seeing how they will approach it. Maybe they'll add a Red Bull style "extremely undercut sidepod" (tunnel)

[MIKEY_!]

That's the logical direction for them to go in. Nice Photoshop btw.

[enz0]

As it seems Alonso and Massa have high hopes for the Spain-spec F2012. Can anybody explain to me in simple terms how a Sauber style exhaust can produce the DF???

[timbo]

Here's what the update for Mugello/Spain might look like? I think the Acer Ducts may be history.

Why not transform Acer ducts into something akin to Macca? IMO it's simpler.

[Crucial_Xtreme]

That's the logical direction for them to go in. Nice Photoshop btw.

Thanks.


Gazzetta keeps going on about the F2012's vertical radiators being the problem of the F2012 and drag. But it's obviously forgetting Sauber has the same vertical radiators and it's fine.

Gazzetta

[MIKEY_!]

The vertical radiators won't cause extra drag themselves but depending on how far forward they are there is potential for a sharp (high drag) turn air must make to reach the bottom of the radiator. In other cars the bottom of the radiator is further back to the turn is less abrupt. The extra surface area of the acer ducts could be the source of the extra drag.

[Crucial_Xtreme]

The vertical radiators won't cause extra drag themselves but depending on how far forward they are there is potential for a sharp (high drag) turn air must make to reach the bottom of the radiator. In other cars the bottom of the radiator is further back to the turn is less abrupt. The extra surface area of the acer ducts could be the source of the extra drag.

I don't think the vertical radiators are the cause of heavy drag on the F2012 either. Sauber for instance has the radiators in the same position. I think it's probably attributed as you mentioned to the extra surface area of the Acer Ducts.

F2012 Rads


Sauber Rads

[elFranZ]

Here's what the update for Mugello/Spain might look like? I think the Acer Ducts may be history.

Why not transform Acer ducts into something akin to Macca? IMO it's simpler.

I don't know if it's simpler, but it's more efficient for sure. And it looks like C31 won't be the car to beat this season, so I'm wondering if all this excitement about their exhausts is justified.

[shelly]

I agree with Crucial. If, as suggested, there is a problem with internal flow drag, pointing out the vertical position of the radiator would lead to a contradiction when comparing ferrari to sauber, which shares the same radiator position but does not semm to suffer from drag.

I think that part of the difference lies in what is not shown in the two pictures, that is the radiator outlet, which has roughly the shape of the sidepod.
So the difference between the acer ducts and the sauber solution is twofold: it does not only influence the external flow, as already been pointed out, but also the internal flow.

The flow velocity through the radiator is not constant across its surface: it will be greater or smaller depending on the shape of the inlet and the outlet.

Ferrari and sauber inlets seem similar, but their outlets are completely different: that could have an effect on the local through velocity distribution.
I do not know if those difference could be significant enough to cause an offset in the drag of the whole system (inlet+radiator+outlet).

Also we do not know anything about the permeability of the radiators (sauber vs ferrari): logic suggests it should be roughly the same, but maybe there is some surprise there.

On a side note (it belongs to another thread), I keep thinking that it is interesting that mclaren has gone for an opposite route, with almost horizontal radiators.