2014-2020 Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
garrett
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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After everybody wrote off Cosworth for the period after 2013 (as they kept a low profile for a long time), it was surprising to read there press release about their plans for building a V6 turbo. Kim Spearman said the following:
"Regularly we have done clean sheet of paper engines in 10 months," he said. "It is something we can do and have done time and again over the years. We would like a bit more than that because it is a complicated engine, but there is still a good amount of time left to do one. We are not particularly stressed at the moment about getting it done."
The question is, how can they be so optimistic as a) their competitors engines are already running dyno on the test bed and b) they have to develop something sophisticated and demanding we have never seen before? So, did they work already on the q.t. or did they even purchase the PURE knowhow to use it for their project??
(if you look at the history of the Cosworth GBA, it was started in December 1984 and the first test took place in August 1985. But it wasn´t as intricate as the 2014 engines).

xpensive
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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I don't think the engine itself is that complicated, a low-boost turbo at a limited rpm and fixed fuel-flow, but the different recovery-systems is what's going to kill a minnow like Cosworth against the big dogs.

But never mind, I don't believe the new formula will happen anyway, at least not in 2014.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

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SeijaKessen
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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When do you suppose the announcement would be made for the 2014 engines being pushed back into who knows when?

I think the offseason would be the best bet since there will be less focus.

But as far as the engines go, does anyone know if the plan is to slowly let teams increase overall engine HP each year after whatever turns out to be the first year they are used?

rjsa
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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Postponing is my guess too, ad aeternum, let's see when the news start popping...

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Holm86
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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Postponing wouldnt that piss of those who allready has a running unit???

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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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Not necessarily, the serious moneyburning will begin with the development of those recovery-systems, booo...
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

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SeijaKessen
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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If cutting costs are really as essential as many teams have been claiming...

Wouldn't it just be cheaper to go back to older spec engines like we had in the early 90s?

I'd love to see what the knowledge accumulated since then could do with a lot of those older engines in terms of efficiency.

bhall
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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What do you think teams could do with an otherwise unrestricted 0.5L engine?

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SeijaKessen
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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bhallg2k wrote:What do you think teams could do with an otherwise unrestricted 0.5L engine?
Spin to 30,000RPM?

I'd wager they could get quite a bit done with it. That would be actually rather novel to see.

aero expert 807
aero expert 807
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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bhallg2k wrote:What do you think teams could do with an otherwise unrestricted 0.5L engine?
They would have 2 choices:
A:] stick a HUGE turbo on it
which would mean huge lag
or
B:]revv the heck out of it
Which would be hard to make it reliable
overall a pretty hefty engineering challenge

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Pierce89
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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aero expert 807 wrote:
bhallg2k wrote:What do you think teams could do with an otherwise unrestricted 0.5L engine?
They would have 2 choices:
A:] stick a HUGE turbo on it
which would mean huge lag
or
B:]revv the heck out of it
Which would be hard to make it reliable
overall a pretty hefty engineering challenge
with no restrictions, they'd probably go for super high revs AND a big honkin' turbo
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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With a boost like in the old qualifying days, 6-7 Bar, and 15 kRpm, they should be able to squeeze out the same power as today's V8s, but what's the point, it would be virtually undriveable with a very small power-window?

I'd like to see the 2.4 V8 with turbo on methanol, without the recovery gizmos, boost set for 900 Hp would be about right.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

noname
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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"Bernie Ecclestone is now happier with the prospect of F1’s V6 engine rules switch. (...)
While at the famous Italian team’s HQ, Ecclestone visited Ferrari’s engine department and heard a live V6 running on the dynomometer, Germany’s Auto Motor und Sport reports.

"Even Bernie Ecclestone was pursuaded by the sound of the engine," the report read."

http://motorsport.nextgen-auto.com/Eccl ... 48522.html

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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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What was he supposed to say when at Maranello, tell Montezuma how ridiculous he thought the tiny engine looked?

Besides, I doubt if he could hear that much in the dyno-room, with ear protection and all?
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

garrett
garrett
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Re: Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

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Not necessarily, the serious moneyburning will begin with the development of those recovery-systems, booo...
The rules concerning ERS and MGUH are very precisely to prevent any "arms race".
The only real moneyburning will take place when the V6 power units will be postponed, because the teams will have to pay additional money for the delay. But no one responsible thinks about it any more. Joe Saward recently explicitly said the new engines will not be postponed. I think he should know.


But, who has any serious information about the Cosworth future in F1? A new V6 power unit in one year? It would be Cosworth´s masterpiece...