Mercedes AMG F1 W04 (pre-launch speculation)

[Mika1]

By the way:

http://youtu.be/m0yI9FxkdjA

Look how fast he is in his Merc AMG W04! .

[_Orfeu_]

some points...

1 - This is the FIRST car who that is done by Aldo Costa, when he was to Mercedes, the W03 has already done

2 - Aldo Costa Knows who design a car not dificulty with tires

3 - Like says Shumacher, NOW and only NOW, Mercedes have a terms to wins, 2010 2011 and 2012 = problems and problems

4 - The Mercedes is working hard since last year for 2013 with conditions, diferent to 2010 2011

5 if Mercedes don´t be champions or not wins some races 2013, no problem, Geoff Willis it´s working in W05 and he is very competent, ok, Aldo is not criative but Geoff is a competent and 2014 can be positive to Mercedes with new motor

6-Geoff Willis is working in W05 to 2014

7 - SO have faith people, Lewis Hamilton + Ross Brawn + Aldo Costa + Bob Bell + Geoff Willis = Red Bull fail

I this it´s possible

Go Mercedes !

my english is terryble, so sorry people, I From Brazil and here the language is portuguese unfortunately

[clipsy1H]

some points...


5 if Mercedes don´t be champions or not wins some races 2013, no problem, Geoff Willis it´s working in W05 and he is very competent, ok, Aldo is not criative but Geoff is a competent and 2014 can be positive to Mercedes with new motor

6-Geoff Willis is working in W05 to 2014

7 - SO have faith people, Lewis Hamilton + Ross Brawn + Aldo Costa + Bob Bell + Geoff Willis = Red Bull fail

I this it´s possible

Go Mercedes !

oh GOD

maybe Newey for W09 ....

[NathanOlder]

Whats all this about Newey ? The guys only won 3 of the last 14 constructor titles. Not all he's cracked up to be maybe ?

[diego1960]

Newey is a genius, no doubt about that. An he has been successful for two different decades, going into the third if I am not mistaken, an old-school designer who draws the cars on paper first and then does the computer work with his team. He basically is a priceless asset, but we all know that to win titles many things must come together, from team harmony, talented drivers, capable engineers, in-season development, important budget, weather conditions and luck. A good solid design is just the basis.

That said, I don't think Mercedes needs Newey now. What they need is to gel together as a team, and fire everyone who is deemed incompetent or sub-par. The quality standards must be raised with as low failure tolerance as possible. Everyone must understand what is at stake there, the team's name and pride. It is not BAR Honda anymore, nor is it Brawn.

Talking about the W04 now, we've been hearing a lot that they will copy the Red-Bull exhaust solution and a new smaller/lighter gearbox. I hope that this means Red-Bull styled side-pods, so to get the best possible airflow to the back of the car and the revised coke-bottle. I wonder what they will do with the FW though. Maybe keeping last year's model, the one with the r-styled elements will be their choice. It remains to be seen. Actually we don't even know if aerodynamically it is going to be a continuation of the W01 lineage or a clean-slate design (I hope that it is a new concept to be honest), and if now they are getting more accurate number correlation from their wind-tunnel/track.

[beelsebob]

Whats all this about Newey ? The guys only won 3 of the last 14 constructor titles. Not all he's cracked up to be maybe ?

1) 5, not 3 – 1998, 1999, 2010, 2011, 2012, that's a 35% hit rate at winning championships, and given that he deliberately chose to join a team that was starting from scratch, it's even more impressive.
2) 14 is an odd place to cut it off. Why not choose 15, or 13? If you'd chosen 22, it would have been 9 out of 22 WCC cars designed by him, or 40% – even more impressive.

[jav]

...
That said, I don't think Mercedes needs Newey now. What they need is to gel together as a team, and fire everyone who is deemed incompetent or sub-par. The quality standards must be raised with as low failure tolerance as possible. Everyone must understand what is at stake there, the team's name and pride. It is not BAR Honda anymore, nor is it Brawn.

....Actually we don't even know if aerodynamically it is going to be a continuation of the W01 lineage or a clean-slate design (I hope that it is a new concept to be honest)...

Mercedes doesn't Newey now, they needed a Newey like figure 3 years ago. I don't see a technical point man. Brawn isn't that guy. Bell has been invisible and unaccountable. The addition of Costa and Willis hasn't brought any real focus...seems like a 3 headed snake (or whatever animal you prefer) .

Being an engineer myself, I've seen a bunch of smart guys around a table, some with ego's or personal vindication at stake, incapable of the singular focus required to tackle a challenge efficiently. All smart guys with great ideas, but unless theres a clear point man that can reign in and converge all efforts with a clear vision, the ideas may not work well together. That has been MGP 3 seasons running. They've had some good, original ideas, but they haven't worked.

I see MS and Norbert's leaving and Lewis' coming as changing nothing in this regard. My bet is 2013 will be, slightly more or slightly less- but mostly- the same.

This design team has 4 options - 1) Go all new "revolutionary". The risk is the guys who are evolving already successful designs are clear odds on favorites to nail the package right out of the gate. 2) Go evolutionary to what they have- they're starting from further back so they have to improve more than their superiors just get on even footing... again possible but unlikely. 3) Try to copy what works... easy to do appearance wise but unless you "understand" the details (which clearly they haven't), it's difficult to copy performance and those with the experience are likely to extract more of it. 4) some blend of all 3... which is what I suspect they'll try given 2014 changes the game.

[_Orfeu_]

I agree with everything you guys say to Newey, but nobody is perfect at it, one day he will lose,

remember the McLaren of Kimi raikonem? 2005 ...,

let's talk about that Mercedes can do, this is not the Mercedes Newey, Newey no use saying ironically to W09,

Newey is Red Bull, no Mercedes,

so where are the other fans mercedes? let's be positive,

in my opinion Bob Bell, Aldo Costa, Geoff Willis, Mike Elliot and Ross Brawn is a great team

[_Orfeu_]

you must watch movie Rocky Balboa,

A fight never ends before the end

[Neno]

you must watch movie Rocky Balboa,

A fight never ends before the end

but we all know that rocky win on end, he is main character. i dont see mercedes like main (top) team, i can only say that what they show in 3 years on track, its quiet bad, specialy when they take over champion team (brawn, i know shitty FIA and hole in regulations but on end they were top team in that moment).
Two words for Mercedes in this moment: They sucks.
I expect a bit more from this team, maybe not winning a championship, but at least putting good fight during all season, not just a two races on beggining of season.

[allstaruk08]

Mercedes kinda remind me of Toyota in F1 its almost as if they're trying too hard to be the best and nothing works out for them. I think the next 2 years will be important years for the team at the end of the day Mercedes dont need a factory team, they can have their name plastered on customer cars.

[Huntresa]

Whats all this about Newey ? The guys only won 3 of the last 14 constructor titles. Not all he's cracked up to be maybe ?

1) 5, not 3 – 1998, 1999, 2010, 2011, 2012, that's a 35% hit rate at winning championships, and given that he deliberately chose to join a team that was starting from scratch, it's even more impressive.
2) 14 is an odd place to cut it off. Why not choose 15, or 13? If you'd chosen 22, it would have been 9 out of 22 WCC cars designed by him, or 40% – even more impressive.

Ferrari won 1999.

[allstaruk08]

Whats all this about Newey ? The guys only won 3 of the last 14 constructor titles. Not all he's cracked up to be maybe ?

1) 5, not 3 – 1998, 1999, 2010, 2011, 2012, that's a 35% hit rate at winning championships, and given that he deliberately chose to join a team that was starting from scratch, it's even more impressive.
2) 14 is an odd place to cut it off. Why not choose 15, or 13? If you'd chosen 22, it would have been 9 out of 22 WCC cars designed by him, or 40% – even more impressive.

Ferrari won 1999.

nope Mika Hakkinen won in a McLaren in 1999 in the MP4/14 designed by (drum roll) Adrian Newey

[ringo]

I feel they can make a leap and be at the top.
Look last year to Williams. Many havent noticed it, but that car was a challenger, a dark horse like the lotus.
That car was vastly better than the 2011 car. There were many races that car could have been won. So i do believe any team can make a big step with a car. All it takes is the culmination of right ideas. Once you know what you are doing, you don't need to put as much time into testing and iteration, limiting your progress.
Williams of 2012 was undermined by the quality of drivers they had. It didn't even need top rank drivers to make it look better.
A Button or Massa would have won more races with that car, or snatched more podiums.
And if we look to where williams was in 2011, i would say they were most improved and they demonstrated that any team can come good in a year's time. So i wont sleep on Mercedes. I'm looking out for them to be challengers. They have the team and most importantly they have one of the realest drivers. They have a driver you simply cannot doubt; you have to doubt the car first.

The driver is a very key aspect, can't be stated enough.Williams with Alonso or Hamilton last year would have been looking completely different. Ross was right in his choices of engineers and driver.
The driver is the one thing Newey has no jurisdiction over. Newey can't put 2 and 2 together on that one.
In fact Horner and Newey's biggest threat the last couple years was a driver. Employing that driver to pilot your car is in fact pretty smart. Redbull can't out develop you on that aspect of the car.

[timbo]

nope Mika Hakkinen won in a McLaren in 1999 in the MP4/14 designed by (drum roll) Adrian Newey

They were talking about WCC.