Team: Bob Bell (TD), Aldo Costa (ED), Geoff Willis (Technology Director), Andrew Shovlin (CRE), Simon Cole (CTE), Ron Meadows (SD), Matthew Deane (CM), Ross Brawn (TP), Nick Fry (CEO), Toto Wolff (Exec Director), Andy Cowell (MD of powertrain),
Drivers: Nico Rosberg (9), Lewis Hamilton (10)
Team name: Mercedes AMG Petronas
He probably mean that Mercedes is not championship car in this moment. For him car didnt show nothing which can make threat to Red Bull, Ferrari and Mclaren, and we can also count Lotus too. He didnt say they are bad, but from what i understand, he said others teams make better job. And i can agree with him. You cant in two months removeMercedesAMG wrote:Mika said that the W04 is not as quick as he had expected. This statement is inexpressive.
If I would expect that the W04 is 5sec quicker than the RedBull and he is only 1 sec faster, then he is not as fast as I expect. But in this case it wouldn't be such bad.
To be fair... It did make the car a front runner. It was mid season lack of development that made the W03 not a frontrunner.turbof1 wrote:To be honest, I also see another grim season for Mercedes. At the 2011 season during testing, Brawn said with the last batch of aero refinements, before the season started, the car was quick enough for the top. We know how that ended. Thinking that the aero updates this testing will suddenly make the car a front runner, is too optimistic.
Read my post again.beelsebob wrote:To be fair... It did make the car a front runner. It was mid season lack of development that made the W03 not a frontrunner.turbof1 wrote:To be honest, I also see another grim season for Mercedes. At the 2011 season during testing, Brawn said with the last batch of aero refinements, before the season started, the car was quick enough for the top. We know how that ended. Thinking that the aero updates this testing will suddenly make the car a front runner, is too optimistic.
Exactly. The entry u/s means you have a lot of lock on, which can then kick out rear when you're accelerating on exit. Its an issue in my father's spec 3 series. And its only 200 hp.Jersey Tom wrote:There are times when you can fix "snap" O/S on exit by just getting rid of entry U/S.
Ater his first outing and it was a brief one, he said the statement that the car lacks downforce compared to last year's McLaren and after his second outing and a full one, he said the statement that the car is where he expected it. So, I would look at it as an optimistic statement. Although he came with very little or no expectations to the team and then he has seen the car and probably reset his expectations.turbof1 wrote:Lewis also said the car is exactly where he hoped it to be. I kinda feel like the 2 statements are a bit contradicting eachother. Surely you aren't hoping that your new car has less DF then your previous?
No comparison, 2011 was a bitch because Mercedes went into the season believing the double diffusor was banned for good and they designed the W02 with the short-wheelbase to feed the conventional diffusor to compensate for that and that was what did their season in. They went down the wrong road and paid dearly for their mistake.turbof1 wrote:Read my post again.beelsebob wrote:To be fair... It did make the car a front runner. It was mid season lack of development that made the W03 not a frontrunner.turbof1 wrote:To be honest, I also see another grim season for Mercedes. At the 2011 season during testing, Brawn said with the last batch of aero refinements, before the season started, the car was quick enough for the top. We know how that ended. Thinking that the aero updates this testing will suddenly make the car a front runner, is too optimistic.
You missed the point. The point is Brawn has a quirk to think end-testing updates will solve everything and make the car a top runner. It's that same pattern of thinking that made them sloppy the last few years.wunderkind wrote:
No comparison, 2011 was a bitch because Mercedes went into the season believing the double diffusor was banned for good and they designed the W02 with the short-wheelbase to feed the conventional diffusor to compensate for that and that was what did their season in. They went down the wrong road and paid dearly for their mistake.
But the design of the W04 is much more in line with the rest of the grid and should be competitive if they can keep pace with the development of the sharp end of the field. At least the car is now a solid and reliable base to work with.
The W02 was a mediocre car at birth with fundamental shortcomings that could not be solved. The W04 does not have the same fundamental shortcomings as we speak.turbof1 wrote:You missed the point. The point is Brawn has a quirk to think end-testing updates will solve everything and make the car a top runner. It's that same pattern of thinking that made them sloppy the last few years.
On that note, the W03 was a great car to start with, after which they failed to develop the car by stubbornly hanging on their DDRS and neglecting updating the car in favour of trying to remedy the tyre wear. Again the issue is that they think to have enough on a great starting car at the first race, which only needs to be updated once and a while.wunderkind wrote:The W02 was a mediocre car at birth with fundamental shortcomings that could not be solved. The W04 does not have the same fundamental shortcomings as we speak.turbof1 wrote:You missed the point. The point is Brawn has a quirk to think end-testing updates will solve everything and make the car a top runner. It's that same pattern of thinking that made them sloppy the last few years.
No amount of new furniture (front and rear wing and other aero bits and pieces) would have cured the W02.
It seems they did plough too many resources in getting the DDRS to work, in hindsight they should have worked more on traction / tyre wear, most teams struggled to understanding tyres early on but then got better, Mercedes seem to go backwards on this.turbof1 wrote: On that note, the W03 was a great car to start with, after which they failed to develop the car by stubbornly hanging on their DDRS and neglecting updating the car in favour of trying to remedy the tyre wear. Again the issue is that they think to have enough on a great starting car at the first race, which only needs to be updated once and a while.
I would tend to disagree that DDRS was a valiant effort. It was a brilliant idea. I would blame it on the lack of good engineering capabilities on Mercedes' part to make the whole car work. If Merc would have been the team to innovate Exhaust Blown Diffuser in 2011, I doubt with their engineering team, W02 would have been a dominating car. Per se, the concept itself cannot be blamed if the team doesn't know how to utilize it.Unc1e_M0nty wrote: I think DDRS was a vailant effort though, nothing ventured nothing gained and all that, it was a complex system to get working right though, and in the end it didn't turn out to be a game changer.
My reading of the whole DDRS situation is that Merc fully expected the bendy front wings to be outlawed or tests so stringent that meant DDRS gave the greater performance.Unc1e_M0nty wrote:
It seems they did plough too many resources in getting the DDRS to work,
