McLaren MP4-28 Mercedes

[bonjon1979]

Just been on the red bull thread, their car just seems to look so much less bulky than the 28. I don't know if it's just me but the 28 looks really bulky in plan view, the sidepods are wide and seem to go on forever where the red bull looks narrower, tighter and the sidepods shorter. May just be me but the mac looks cumbersome, what does everyone else think?

[beelsebob]

Just been on the red bull thread, their car just seems to look so much less bulky than the 28. I don't know if it's just me but the 28 looks really bulky in plan view, the sidepods are wide and seem to go on forever where the red bull looks narrower, tighter and the sidepods shorter. May just be me but the mac looks cumbersome, what does everyone else think?

Simple difference in philosophy. Red Bull's is to clear the rear floor at all heights. McLaren's is that all the useful air comes round the bottom of the side pods, or over the top, so to move all the body work away from those two places, but not care about in between.

[Owen.C93]

It will tighten up at the next test no doubt.

[Owen.C93]

http://www.formule1.nl/media/uploads/me ... 204.74.jpg

Gurney tabs on the sidepod floor flickups o_o.

[Trocola]

Ooh dear

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105661

This might explain why the flow conditioners have been removed, they might not be doing what mclaren expected them to do

That's what happens when you have Button as your nº1 driver: He never finds grip or balance.

Sorry to say this, but Mclaren is doomed. This would be a terrible year for them

[Pup]

Mclaren is doomed.

Clearly.

[raymondu999]

Ooh dear

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105661

This might explain why the flow conditioners have been removed, they might not be doing what mclaren expected them to do

That's what happens when you have Button as your nº1 driver: He never finds grip or balance.

Sorry to say this, but Mclaren is doomed. This would be a terrible year for them

I don't think this issue in particular is one of Button's phantom "no balance" moments. IMO Button is talking more in terms of understanding the car technically. I could be wrong about this - but I think what Button means to say is that the car isn't responding to setup (and developmental) changes as they think it should.

Don't forget that these tyres are apparently wildly changing the balance from beginnings to ends of stints too. This could be affecting Button more than most, rather than having Button's style reduce the wear.

[sirexilon]

Ooh dear

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/105661

This might explain why the flow conditioners have been removed, they might not be doing what mclaren expected them to do

That's what happens when you have Button as your nº1 driver: He never finds grip or balance.

Sorry to say this, but Mclaren is doomed. This would be a terrible year for them

I don't think this issue in particular is one of Button's phantom "no balance" moments. IMO Button is talking more in terms of understanding the car technically. I could be wrong about this - but I think what Button means to say is that the car isn't responding to setup (and developmental) changes as they think it should.

Don't forget that these tyres are apparently wildly changing the balance from beginnings to ends of stints too. This could be affecting Button more than most, rather than having Button's style reduce the wear.

Did you guys saw this video? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqh01JhE ... CAmXTwju0o

It really makes me think if their made a mistake in going Ferrari's way of front suspension. He points out at "HIGH"tyre degradation because of the roll of the car, which yes it will warm the front tyres faster, but it will also increase the wear of them big time. And if we add this to the high degradation fo this year tyres, maybe we'll have a problem.

I just hope is not like that.

[sirexilon]

What do you guys think? I know the angles are not teh same, but getting that the wheels are the only think equal to all cars, we can have an Idea of where the coanda channel points to.
Seams very different.






https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... nt_count=1

[zonk]

first: it should go to car comparison topic.
second: thing about coanda effect is the fluids stick to the surface.
third: +1 for the try

[Mr.G]

On the HiRes picture from Blackout, it looks like an radiator in the opening behind the driver's head. Probably for gearbox oil like in Ferrari.

[Coefficient]

What do you guys think? I know the angles are not teh same, but getting that the wheels are the only think equal to all cars, we can have an Idea of where the coanda channel points to.
Seams very different.


https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos- ... 4570_n.jpg



https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid ... nt_count=1

Its not as simple as this illustration suggests. The exhaust outlets are angled differently for each car in order to harmonize with the flow coming over and around the side pods. I believe Mclaren uses the airflow from around the sidepod undercut below the exhaust pod as a virual ramp for the exhaust mass flow and because they are deliberately allowing the 2 flow structures to interact they need to angle the exhaust outwards as the flow around the sidepods pushes the exhaust flow back inboard slightly so it hits the desired spot between the rear wheels and diffuser edge. This is the trick that I believe the other non ramp teams are missing by pointing their exhausts directly at the intended area because if the above is correct then presumably the other team's exhaust flow will be moved even further unboard by the oncoming flow around their sidepods which could be why Mclaren appear to get more from this solution than the other teams. It must have been a very complex thing to model correctly!!

[scarbs]

On the HiRes picture from Blackout, it looks like an radiator in the opening behind the driver's head. Probably for gearbox oil like in Ferrari.

Its the KERS cooler...

[stefan_]

Barcelona Session 1 - Day 4 (22.02.2013)

[bonjon1979]

Just been on the red bull thread, their car just seems to look so much less bulky than the 28. I don't know if it's just me but the 28 looks really bulky in plan view, the sidepods are wide and seem to go on forever where the red bull looks narrower, tighter and the sidepods shorter. May just be me but the mac looks cumbersome, what does everyone else think?

Simple difference in philosophy. Red Bull's is to clear the rear floor at all heights. McLaren's is that all the useful air comes round the bottom of the side pods, or over the top, so to move all the body work away from those two places, but not care about in between.

I'm sure they are different design philosophies but I don't quite understand your explanation. Surely, Red Bull also have more 'useful air' coming around the bottom of the side pods as they have more room there above the floor? Their sidepods leave open space on the floor the length of the sidepods and I'm not sure I see how Mclaren have moved any more body work away over the top of the sidepods either. I'm not an aerodynamicist and not really that well versed in the technicalities of it all but I can't see where Red Bull loses out to Mclaren in the two areas you speak off - ie air around the side of the sidepods and over the top and they seem to have cleared much more space at the back. I'm sure it is just different, it could be that the red bull has a higher centre of gravity as they've packed more components high on the centre line to make space at the side. There'll be loads we don't understand about why these cars work the way they do and I'm not saying Big is necessarily worse, it just strikes me that the Mclaren looks pretty bulky from plan view.