ARROWS - Cockpit Simulation Racing System

[Smokes]

Do you race any class of R/C at club level ? Most Clubs in the UK barely make a profit even though they have a high attendancy. The Reason why the clubs are still around is because they were established 30 years ago. The most recent track is based at silverstone with a similar concept as yours but it is struggling.

look on oOple.com forums before going further.

It would probably be better to create a VRC pro simulator to reduce costs and risk.

[No Lotus]

I commend what you are trying to do. It's not easy, but doing something really new like this seldom is. To my mind, racing an R/C car in this way is potentially much more interesting than a computer sim. The reason has to do with the fact that you are actually racing a real physical thing, with all the intangibles that that entails as opposed to a virtual car. Being at a real physical limit on a real track, as opposed to a calculated one, makes a huge difference. It makes it really interesting and a lot more fun. Regular R/C doesn't give you this because of the third person point of view and the necessarily removed experience. I've done a fair bit of R/C racing with cars, power boats, one meter sail boats, and F3F gliders and have always looked forward to the day when real-time video would give the driver/pilot a first person point of view. I think the time is near. Please keep it up! I do think that the video camera will have to be suspended with it's own damping system and the speed of the 1/5th scale cars slowed to make it more reasonable for reaction times and to keep it more to scale.

[Caito]

If you're watching video, what's better than a PC Game with all the same simulator?

[arrowscsrs]

Do you race any class of R/C at club level ? Most Clubs in the UK barely make a profit even though they have a high attendancy. The Reason why the clubs are still around is because they were established 30 years ago. The most recent track is based at silverstone with a similar concept as yours but it is struggling.

look on oOple.com forums before going further.

It would probably be better to create a VRC pro simulator to reduce costs and risk.

Tks.
Can u give more info on the Silverstone club.

[arrowscsrs]

I commend what you are trying to do. It's not easy, but doing something really new like this seldom is. To my mind, racing an R/C car in this way is potentially much more interesting than a computer sim. The reason has to do with the fact that you are actually racing a real physical thing, with all the intangibles that that entails as opposed to a virtual car. Being at a real physical limit on a real track, as opposed to a calculated one, makes a huge difference. It makes it really interesting and a lot more fun. Regular R/C doesn't give you this because of the third person point of view and the necessarily removed experience. I've done a fair bit of R/C racing with cars, power boats, one meter sail boats, and F3F gliders and have always looked forward to the day when real-time video would give the driver/pilot a first person point of view. I think the time is near. Please keep it up! I do think that the video camera will have to be suspended with it's own damping system and the speed of the 1/5th scale cars slowed to make it more reasonable for reaction times and to keep it more to scale.

Exactly what we think.
Reality and proportions are the key words.
We do not want to built the fastest RC there is. We want to built it replicating the real race car on track behavior.
And that is what gap virtual reality technology was and still is filling on all levels.
But we too thing the technology is there to implement it in our case.
But, it must be done properly.
Now if that costs a lot to built makes no sense to market it as a unit to sale, but it does make sense to trade it as a service.
The user can rent time on the cockpit racing the race cars available, not requiring to purchase anything.

If you really think highly of our plan, we would appreciate your endorsement either by voting for ARROWS in the Indiegogo campaign, or by registering you in our Facebook page, or both.
Your support is after all what this is all about.

[arrowscsrs]

If you're watching video, what's better than a PC Game with all the same simulator?

As we look it the real thing is the top, the uncontested king.
Thereafter RC and PC are battling to get the user the closest possible in experiencing the real thing.
At the end it really gets down to what you prefer.
Having said that, contrary to the PC game, driving an RC gives room for the unpredictable.
So to compare same things, if I was given the chance to drive through a pro simulator either an actual race car
or a virtual race car, I would go for the first.

[A13EX_f]

having raced R/c cars all around the world at a semi professional level (uk and european no 1 and world n7 in my class) also I enjoy go karts, If I wanted this kind of experience I would go karting or play on a playstation / arcade simulator. if I wanted to race r/c cars I would go r/c car racing, the two would never work. no r/c club would ever invest in the equipment if you go to most rc clubs you will notice they often run a computer thats 10 years out of date to do the lap counting etc.

[Smokes]

having raced R/c cars all around the world at a semi professional level (uk and european no 1 and world n7 in my class) also I enjoy go karts, If I wanted this kind of experience I would go karting or play on a playstation / arcade simulator. if I wanted to race r/c cars I would go r/c car racing, the two would never work. no r/c club would ever invest in the equipment if you go to most rc clubs you will notice they often run a computer thats 10 years out of date to do the lap counting etc.

i agree with that why i still race rc cars for fun

[arrowscsrs]

having raced R/c cars all around the world at a semi professional level (uk and european no 1 and world n7 in my class) also I enjoy go karts, If I wanted this kind of experience I would go karting or play on a playstation / arcade simulator. if I wanted to race r/c cars I would go r/c car racing, the two would never work. no r/c club would ever invest in the equipment if you go to most rc clubs you will notice they often run a computer thats 10 years out of date to do the lap counting etc.

OK your class RC racers will be the most difficult to convert.
Allow me to clarify though that no computers are involved in ARROWS.
Is a cockpit that interfaces with an RC model on an FPV environment.
I would say it has more to do with kart vs RC rather than PC gaming.
In that sense when you go karting, do you get to race the kart the way you race your RC ?
Cause if you do there is no way I can persuade you.
So the question is would you like the idea of racing your RC from inside a cockpit using driver's view?

[Smokes]

karting has a different feel to an r/c car, as it has solidaxle pneumatic tyre and a rear disc brake on the lower classes and a gutless throttle response.
With Karting you have to get inside rear tyre to lift in order to get it to turn, so you need to be able to control your weight transfers and use some opposite lock to control some of the sliding on exits. It also leaves bruises on your rib cage from the flat out corners. It is very seat of the pant feel and tactile.

With a rc car the throttle response is instantainous due to the low weight ,and with electric cars peak torque starts at 0 rpm and will rev to 100K rpm for brushless motors. it all about being smooth on the throttle and being able to feel the car as the braking is done by the eletric motor as well you can lock up the axel very easily if you want some 4wd buggys guys can pull endos with them though we tend to use drag braking when coming off throttle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICQELnuOXAI watch the world best throttle and steering inputs.

[A13EX_f]

Without trying to sound harsh I think you've trying to create a solution to a problem that doesn't exist

[arrowscsrs]

karting has a different feel to an r/c car, as it has solidaxle pneumatic tyre and a rear disc brake on the lower classes and a gutless throttle response.
With Karting you have to get inside rear tyre to lift in order to get it to turn, so you need to be able to control your weight transfers and use some opposite lock to control some of the sliding on exits. It also leaves bruises on your rib cage from the flat out corners. It is very seat of the pant feel and tactile.

With a rc car the throttle response is instantainous due to the low weight ,and with electric cars peak torque starts at 0 rpm and will rev to 100K rpm for brushless motors. it all about being smooth on the throttle and being able to feel the car as the braking is done by the eletric motor as well you can lock up the axel very easily if you want some 4wd buggys guys can pull endos with them though we tend to use drag braking when coming off throttle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICQELnuOXAI watch the world best throttle and steering inputs.

I am sure RC and kart a hell different, most importantly that you are actually on the later. And appreciating what you say, the bottom line is you get a lot more reality out of it, just for being there.
On the other hand, I would never be able to race a kart as fast as I would do a car. Not only because the kart corners differently, but just because my butt will be 2inches above ground and I would be totally unprotected.
I admitted I am afraid, so I will drive nice and easily around the track.

I will tell you a quick story.
I bought my first (and only) electric RC buggy back in the late '80s. I spent my entire salary on it and I have spent 3 full days trying to put it together. I enjoyed it tremendously and I never regret the money I put in it. But building it was the best experience I ever got from RC. When I tried it, I could not make it run straight with those difficult transmitters, let alone to corner it or even getting close to control it back to me. The left/right and micro corrections required were impossible for me. I lost interest right away mostly because I realized it would not be what I had imagined it would be. I was determined that it would never give me the feeling I would wanted.
When some part got broke that same day I gave it to my friend to keep. I know today's trigger/knob transmitters are far better, but now I lost interest. That does not mean I cannot admire others doing it.

Some time later I moved into PC simulation. Same problem, great (for the time) visuals, but nope, could not get it controlled in a satisfactory manner. Using a steering wheel/pedals set I got as a gift, thinks were even worse. I was steering in any awkward position imaginable without any good. Plus the feeling of the wheel but most importantly of the pedals was zero. PS1 then came alone, setting a whole new standards, but still the lever controlling did not assist ma at all. I did managed to drive it but I was never comfortable I had full control of where the car was getting.

As I said in karting I could have been much better enjoying it more, if it wasn't for fear of personal injury.

So you now know my sad, sad story and poor experience I had with all three medians.
Just for the record driving a car was never a problem for me - I am not the best driver ever, nor I ever raced a car, but I had my time doing stupid - not always safe things in it, but never got the feeling I was not controlling it even in adverse conditions.

Now I am sure I am not alone out there, I mean a lot of people enjoy RC, PC and karts as much as I do, but they just can not and do not get the most out of them.

And is to those ARROWS is for.
To people than can race a real model car that drives like the real thing, getting the drivers feeling and perspective, but without them being in there.

How is that different from a PC simulation ?
Unless we are taking about the professional racing simulators, it will be beyond comparison.

[arrowscsrs]

Without trying to sound harsh I think you've trying to create a solution to a problem that doesn't exist

You are definitely not and that is why we had this thread, to listen to what other people think.
So accept what you say and I wish you could elaborate some more on the specific reasons you say it.
Please always consider your background in RC racing on the level you had.

To start with we are not offering a solution, just an alternative with many benefits.

They way we like to see it, is as if we are trying to introduce the e-cigarette to smokers.
When referring to smokers consider being the race car enthusiasts.
What do smokers want ?
I am a smoker so I will tell you it is the nicotine, the drug that gives pleasure.
Pleasure comes form the brain when a stimulant triggers the release of a chemical stuff in there.

So the stimulant for a race car enthusiasts is .....
Each one of us can fill in the gap with whatever he wants.

But all of them will get down to the basics, to be in the driver's shoes, to experience that feeling.
Plus the winning.

Unless one has access and to a race car, the alternatives are karting, RC racing, PC gaming getting from the most expensive to the least.
Each approach the objective from its own angle with its own pros and cons.
We believe ARROWS gets to the same target, using the pros of all three without their cons.

Like in the nicotine lovers, next to cigarettes, cigars, nicotine gums and patches, comes the e-cig offering nicotine without smell, without tar - the bad stuff cigarettes give, and unlike gums and patches with a smoke like vapor to inhale in a cigarette like "packet".

[Pup]

I see zombies.

[Nando]

I can't remember what frame rates video games use, my computing class seems like ages back!

Different games reacts differently on FPS, some games 40fps is manageable but other games you need somewhere around 70-80 to make it feel smooth (even if your screen only puts out 60Hz)