Mercedes AMG F1 W04

[Cocles]

Hamilton is channeling Wolff, who said the same thing to Autosport:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/107404

On a different note, during the race in Barcelona, the American commentators noticed that the left rear tire was running straight if not slightly positive camber. I'm guessing this was to squeeze a little more endurance out of the tires. Has anyone seen anything more about a brand new rear suspension for Monaco? Costa apparently told an Italian newspaper this.

[thomin]

The latest theory that I've heard is that it has to do with the engine mapping. Presumably, the Mercedes engine is the strongest one by quite a bit which gives them more torque accelerating out of corners, but with these high degradation tires, this advantage is transformed into a disadvantage.

[Mika1]

The latest theory that I've heard is that it has to do with the engine mapping. Presumably, the Mercedes engine is the strongest one by quite a bit which gives them more torque accelerating out of corners, but with these high degradation tires, this advantage is transformed into a disadvantage.

I don't know if that's true, but Wolff said the torque of the turbo engines will eat the tyres in 2014, so if they don't fix it, it will ruin their 2014 season. It's so important to improve tyre management.

[hollus]

Yet another theory that Joan Viladelprat advanced in a Spanish newspaper: the brake disks they are using, which "are not the normal ones" have a higher optimum temperature and this is eventually overheating the tires.
http://deportes.elpais.com/deportes/201 ... 16026.html
Not sure how much water the theory holds. Are Rosberg and Hamilton using the same brake disks?

[mantikos]

Yet another theory that Joan Viladelprat advanced in a Spanish newspaper: the brake disks they are using, which "are not the normal ones" have a higher optimum temperature and this is eventually overheating the tires.
http://deportes.elpais.com/deportes/201 ... 16026.html
Not sure how much water the theory holds. Are Rosberg and Hamilton using the same brake disks?

No, the story is claiming Hamilton suffers more than Rosberg because his brakes (which other sources have confirmed on Twitter are not the same as ROS's brakes) need more heat to operate.


Overall it sounds like they (Merc) believe the damage is done by the tire warmers or other handling procedures prior to racing that are unique to them.

[ringo]

When the teams get the tyres, can they do anything they want with them?
Maybe expose the tyre to some thermal cycling to change the characteristics.

Other than that, i can see where brake cooling and wheel rim cooling can be an area of development.

[siskue2005]

When the teams get the tyres, can they do anything they want with them?
Maybe expose the tyre to some thermal cycling to change the characteristics.

Other than that, i can see where brake cooling and wheel rim cooling can be an area of development.

No, thats illegal

[Shakeman]

When the teams get the tyres, can they do anything they want with them?
Maybe expose the tyre to some thermal cycling to change the characteristics.

Other than that, i can see where brake cooling and wheel rim cooling can be an area of development.

No, thats illegal

Only if you get caught.

There remains a possibility that there is tempering happening and working with a grey area of the tyre heating rules. I know that's clutching at straws but Merc have been amazingly honest and said they haven't got much of a clue and are looking everywhere.

[tranquility2k4]

Pirelli changing their tyres then for Canadian GP. Looks like they're using 2012 structure and 2013 compound with a few tweaks to make them more conservative. From everything written on auto-und-motor-sport, it looks like this will help RBR and Merc a lot:

It is clear that Pirelli largely accepts the 2012 carcass. "But there are still some elements of this year's construction be included. The purpose of the amendment is that the mixtures do not heat up as much, especially at the rear."

For the aerodynamics, this means a lot of work. The new tires are walken deform less and less in cornering. This could possibly be the salvation for teams like McLaren, Sauber and Williams. It will definitely also Red Bull and Mercedes help because they have a smaller range of chassis adjustments, to respond to the strong flexing of the tire. For Ferrari, Lotus and Force India, it may be bad news. This Hembery: "Pirelli Pirelli have to think about now."

The bit that stands out to me especially is that the new tyres will not heat up at the rear - this will surely help Merc. Also the fact that they will be less aggressive in corners will also surely help the 2 fastest cars in RBR and Merc as they put more load through the tyre.

[NewtonMeter]

Although the tyre changes are very welcome for Merc and I hope it helps them. I do pity Lotus in this.

As much as I enthusiastically dislike Lotus, this isn't fair towards them. They happen to have built a car that works well with the tyres. If they go on to win the championship (or even just do very well for the rest of the season), it's their just reward.

But by golly I hope they don't...

[siskue2005]

When the teams get the tyres, can they do anything they want with them?
Maybe expose the tyre to some thermal cycling to change the characteristics.

Other than that, i can see where brake cooling and wheel rim cooling can be an area of development.

No, thats illegal

Only if you get caught.

There remains a possibility that there is tempering happening and working with a grey area of the tyre heating rules. I know that's clutching at straws but Merc have been amazingly honest and said they haven't got much of a clue and are looking everywhere.

No, all sorts of chemical and thermal treatment are banned
Remember back in 2003 ferrari had a thermal heating chamber, which was later banned

and also at 2006 Michelin and Renault complained that Bstones are treating their tyres with some chemicals and wanted FIA to interfere...they even produced a picture of b'stone mechanic with protective suit

FIA clarified all sorts of such treatments are illegal
that was in tyre war era , now with control tyres it is all easily monitered as there are Bstone mechanics in every garage

[kooleracer]

After reading today's news about the Pirelli and some interesting comments form Paul Hembery. I really think Mercedes has build a fast car but the car is to fast for the tyres.

Its sound strange but: "We're looking at compounds and structure, and the idea is obviously to get back to our two/three stop strategies," Hembery said. "What you've got at the moment is a combination of the cars are really going hard - much harder than we had anticipated, big steps forward in performance - together with a structure that pushes very heavily the compounds. It's a very aggressive structure in the corners and you're pushing the compounds beyond the limits. ESPN F1 interview.

So the quali pace of Merc shows that car is quick but at same time Merc during quali takes the tyres beyond there limit. The tyres can cope with that for 1 lap with less fuel. But doing the same with heavy fuel means abusing the tyres with the result of overheating issues. I never thought i was going to say this, but Mercedes have to build slower car . The STR with Riccardio was 1.1 sec of lewis during qualifying but ended 2 places higher then Lewis. This proves that slower cars put less stress in the tyres with the result of less abuse during the race.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPb_hspNGxE[/youtube]

[Richard]

For the avoidance of doubt, this is not a Pirelli thread, nor is it the team thread, nor is it the Monaco or Barcelona thread.

I admire the passion of the Merc fans, but this isn't the place for dumping all your woes. We're not going to see any new bits on the car for a week-ish so I'll leave this locked until we have something that is on topic.

Send "moderators" a PM if you have something on topic to reopen this thread

[kilcoo316]

I admire the passion of the Merc fans, but this isn't the place for dumping all your woes.

[OFF TOPIC]
Do they have a thread to dump their woes in?
What is the intended scope of these threads?


[ON TOPIC]
I would imagine with the tyre changes, teams will be very careful about what they introduce onto the car over the next few race weekends, as they could easily get themselves lost. So expect to see all "performance" upgrades put on the shelf for the time being, and efforts concentrated on adapting to the "new" tyres.

[Richard]

Do they have a thread to dump their woes in?

This thread is intended to focus on the actual features of the car. We have the team thread thread for talking about the team, and the race thread for talking about the laptimes and tyres in the race.