Mercedes AMG F1 W04

[stefan_]

Monaco 2013 - Thursday (23.05.2013)

[dans79]

Has anyone seen any good shots of the new rear on Lewis's car?

[Richard]

There must be a lot of vibration on those cameras on the front wings. I wonder why they didn't mount them on the main bodywork, ie tub/airbox/sidepods?

[Adamski]

There must be a lot of vibration on those cameras on the front wings. I wonder why they didn't mount them on the main bodywork, ie tub/airbox/sidepods?

As Ted mentioned in free practice one it is more a square view on the tyres which is better than the solutions other teams use (I don't know those).

Anyway the vibration on the front wing only makes vertical movements so I don't think it's a big deal as horizontal monitoring on tyres are more important I think.

[marcush.]

come to think of it -is it wise to monitor the tyre temp BEFORE the measured field turns into the contact patch?
From my point of view i would love to see whats happening directly after the tread separates from the tracksurface spreading out the heat ,cooling down by the airflow and reentering the track .
It might or might not be aerodynmically more disturbing to intrude into the wake of the front tyre but generally we are made to believe the front wing itself was the all determiningfactor in aero...
any ideas why they chose this area? to complement the rear IR sensors ,maybe?

[ForMuLaOne]

come to think of it -is it wise to monitor the tyre temp BEFORE the measured field turns into the contact patch?
From my point of view i would love to see whats happening directly after the tread separates from the tracksurface spreading out the heat ,cooling down by the airflow and reentering the track .
It might or might not be aerodynmically more disturbing to intrude into the wake of the front tyre but generally we are made to believe the front wing itself was the all determiningfactor in aero...
any ideas why they chose this area? to complement the rear IR sensors ,maybe?

I thought the same. They really change the conditions for the front tyres by disturbing the normal flow. Although this effect is really small, it changes the situation.

[Richard]

I'm not sure if the leading edge of the tyre would noticeably cool down in 3/4 of one rotation.

Say average speed at Monaco is 170 kph http://www.motorsportsetc.com/info/spd_mon.htm
Wheel dia = 660mm
Hence rpm = 1366

What I can imagine happening is the tyre temperature varying during a lap because the applied the forces vary. I can imagine the distribution across the tyre varying depending on the lateral forces.

Having said all that, they'd get best result son a track with long straights, long corners, long technical sections. Monaco is probably too mixed up to get a consistent data set. Although some data would be better than none even if it only identifies extremes and outliers rather than nuances?

[aral]

Surely it does not matter where the tyre temp is being monitored? Once the base datum has been set, they can then monitor what effect any change of aero has on the tyre. If more front wing produces a higher temp, then they know what effect will be for other changes.

[Jersey Tom]

Is there the possibility these things are looking at more than just the tire? Like getting a more full on shot of the back of the car, what heat looks like in the wake, anything like that? Seems like the front wing would obstruct most of the view of the tire itself.

But other than that... suppose it just comes down to opinion - do you think it's more insightful to look at the trailing edge of the footprint right as it comes off the ground, or the leading edge as it's about to go to the ground, or are they both close enough that it doesn't make a difference, or do you think IR measurements are meaningful at all.

[NewtonMeter]

Is there the possibility these things are looking at more than just the tire? Like getting a more full on shot of the back of the car, what heat looks like in the wake, anything like that? Seems like the front wing would obstruct most of the view of the tire itself.

Well, I guess it depends on what type of heat is measured by the optical sensor? I know very little of those, but do they measure radiated heat or convective heat? Or both?

Convective heat won't reach the front of the car (at speed), and hence the sensor (if my somewhat elementary knowledge of heat transfer can be trusted). And I don't think a relevant source of radiation heat will be visible from where the camera is mounted?


Too much thinking for me already today - I need a beer.

[Jersey Tom]

Is it optical? Or is it IR? Or is it something else? I'm curious just what kind of camera or sensor it is, to be honest. Looks awfully big.

[NewtonMeter]

Is it optical? Or is it IR? Or is it something else? I'm curious just what kind of camera or sensor it is, to be honest. Looks awfully big.

I have no idea...now that you mention it.

[Huntresa]

Isnt it just a camera with a heatsensor?

[cherok1212]

Maybe a camera lookin @ tire deflection/deformation in relation to camber angles and a heat sensor to correlate deformation to temps. Just a guess, but Monaco doesn't seem to be a good place to gather this info.

[marcush.]

you would need a stereo camera to derive any signifcant dimensional data ,don´t you ?

for a IR Sensor it´s a bit big considering the size of Texense product portfolio .

so it´s more likely it´s a minature Thermographic camera we might see here -sort of mikrobolometer sensor array with an optical lens in front giving real time surface temperature pictures( the shades of grey are then processed to a colour scale
giving the typical thermograhy pictures ...the microblometer can be mapped for that ,the tyre tread is a fairly good surface to take those surface temps from .
the videostream can be synchronised with the data logging and it may well be feasible to define areas of the Tyre surface from were to take discrete temperature reading to draw graph from .Something like this is a standard feature on NI Diadem
I´d assume the software in use by Formula 1 does not lag behind in this .