Technical Regulations for 2009-2015

[Holm86]

There will be 8 gears instead of 7 and as far as I know the fuel flow limited turbo engines will be much less peaky than current V8s.

Correct, all teams will use 8 speed gearboxes, as per rule 9.6.1. They must chose their gear ratios before the season starts, and they may change their choice once during the season.

Thats right. And thats why i believe the ratios will be a comprimise. I predict that they won't use 8'th and possible not even 7'th gear at Monaco.

[strad]

Thats right. And thats why i believe the ratios will be a comprimise. I predict that they won't use 8'th and possible not even 7'th gear at Monaco.

It's always a compromise and at Monaco they will just stack more gear on it. I wonder what kind of gear ratios they run in the rear end. Monaco a 5 something and the high speed tracks a low to mid 3 ??? Or am I way off?

[Holm86]

Thats right. And thats why i believe the ratios will be a comprimise. I predict that they won't use 8'th and possible not even 7'th gear at Monaco.

It's always a compromise and at Monaco they will just stack more gear on it. I wonder what kind of gear ratios they run in the rear end. Monaco a 5 something and the high speed tracks a low to mid 3 ??? Or am I way off?

Perhaps its some sort of compromise. But gearboxes are still "tailored" to every track today. They won't be next year.

"They will just stack more gear on it." I dont understand what you mean by that?? "I wonder what kind of gear ratios they run in the rear end." And what do you mean by this?? Do you mean the final drive ratio in the diff??

[strad]

Yes...They will just run a lower..higher numerically..diff ratio at Monaco

[Holm86]

Yes...They will just run a lower..higher numerically..diff ratio at Monaco

This is not allowed according to the technical regulations part 9.6.2

"Each competitor must nominate the forward gear ratios (calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts) to be employed within their gearbox. These nominations must be declared to the FIA technical delegate at or before the first Event of the Championship. For 2014 only a competitor may re-nominate these ratios once within the Championship season, in which case the original nomination becomes immediately void. Ratio re-nominations must be declared as a set."

"(calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts)" To me this says that the final drive ratio is included in the fixed ratios.

[tim|away]

I have a question about article 29.5 of the sporting regulations for 2014 that I hope one of you can clarify.

No car is permitted to consume more than 100kg of fuel, from the time at which the signal to start the race is given to the time each car crosses the Line after the end of race signal has been given. Other than in cases of force majeure (accepted as such by the stewards of the meeting), any driver exceeding this limit will be excluded from the race results.

I would assume that they can only measure the fuel quantities before the formation lap and after the final in-lap. Therefore, it appears as if neither the formation lap nor the final in-lap counts towards that 100 kg fuel limit. Could someone try to clarify this for me, as neither the actual starting quantity nor the ending quantity can actually be determined directly by the FIA- at best they can estimate both figures by measuring the fuel before the formation lap and after the final in-lap.

[Holm86]

I have a question about article 29.5 of the sporting regulations for 2014 that I hope one of you can clarify.

No car is permitted to consume more than 100kg of fuel, from the time at which the signal to start the race is given to the time each car crosses the Line after the end of race signal has been given. Other than in cases of force majeure (accepted as such by the stewards of the meeting), any driver exceeding this limit will be excluded from the race results.

I would assume that they can only measure the fuel quantities before the formation lap and after the final in-lap. Therefore, it appears as if neither the formation lap nor the final in-lap counts towards that 100 kg fuel limit. Could someone try to clarify this for me, as neither the actual starting quantity nor the ending quantity can actually be determined directly by the FIA- at best they can estimate both figures by measuring the fuel before the formation lap and after the final in-lap.

I believe this i how i works:

FIA uses telemetry of the standard fuel flow meters to monitor that no-one violates the 100kg/h limit. This is monitored every second of the race and my guess is that they just calculate the total amound of fuel used from the start signal to the finish line from this data.

[beelsebob]

I have a question about article 29.5 of the sporting regulations for 2014 that I hope one of you can clarify.

No car is permitted to consume more than 100kg of fuel, from the time at which the signal to start the race is given to the time each car crosses the Line after the end of race signal has been given. Other than in cases of force majeure (accepted as such by the stewards of the meeting), any driver exceeding this limit will be excluded from the race results.

I would assume that they can only measure the fuel quantities before the formation lap and after the final in-lap. Therefore, it appears as if neither the formation lap nor the final in-lap counts towards that 100 kg fuel limit. Could someone try to clarify this for me, as neither the actual starting quantity nor the ending quantity can actually be determined directly by the FIA- at best they can estimate both figures by measuring the fuel before the formation lap and after the final in-lap.

You're right about the final in-lap. The formation lap though occurs after the start of the race – it is in fact the first lap of the race.

[strad]

Within their gearbox...That's Transmission.
imo they have to be able to change final drive from track to track. How ya gonna run Monaco gearing at Spa?

[Holm86]

Within their gearbox...That's Transmission.

The diff is still part of the transmission.

imo they have to be able to change final drive from track to track. How ya gonna run Monaco gearing at Spa?

Thats why i say it has to be a compromise. And that they probably won't use 8'th or 7'th gear at Monaco.

Regulations still says this ""Each competitor must nominate the forward gear ratios (calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts) to be employed within their gearbox." Pay notice to the "calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts). The drive shafts is AFTER the diff!! Thats why according to regulations final drive is also fixed!

[beelsebob]

Within their gearbox...That's Transmission.

The diff is still part of the transmission.

imo they have to be able to change final drive from track to track. How ya gonna run Monaco gearing at Spa?

Thats why i say it has to be a compromise. And that they probably won't use 8'th or 7'th gear at Monaco.

Regulations still says this ""Each competitor must nominate the forward gear ratios (calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts) to be employed within their gearbox." Pay notice to the "calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts). The drive shafts is AFTER the diff!! Thats why according to regulations final drive is also fixed!

Of note, the rules don't seem to specify that the actual hardware in the gearbox remains the same, I guess in theory you could change the diff ratio if you also changed all the gears in the gearbox so that the resulting ratio was the same. I can't see any way an advantage could be derived from that, but I wonder if it's possible?

[Holm86]

Within their gearbox...That's Transmission.

The diff is still part of the transmission.

imo they have to be able to change final drive from track to track. How ya gonna run Monaco gearing at Spa?

Thats why i say it has to be a compromise. And that they probably won't use 8'th or 7'th gear at Monaco.

Regulations still says this ""Each competitor must nominate the forward gear ratios (calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts) to be employed within their gearbox." Pay notice to the "calculated from engine crankshaft to drive shafts). The drive shafts is AFTER the diff!! Thats why according to regulations final drive is also fixed!

Of note, the rules don't seem to specify that the actual hardware in the gearbox remains the same, I guess in theory you could change the diff ratio if you also changed all the gears in the gearbox so that the resulting ratio was the same. I can't see any way an advantage could be derived from that, but I wonder if it's possible?

You need to look in the Sporting Regulations for that.

The sporting regulations 28.6 says this :
d) Change gears and dog rings (excluding final drives or reduction gears) may be changed under supervision for others of identical specification at any time during an Event provided the FIA technical delegate is satisfied there is evident physical damage to the parts in question and that such changes are not being carried out on a systematic basis.
For 2014 only, on five occasions per driver, a competitor need not provide evidence of physical damage in order to carry out these changes. Furthermore, the use of parts of identical specification will not be necessary when the changes are being made in accordance with Article 9.6.2 of the F1 Technical Regulations.

So if you change what you call hardware i.e. the gears themselves they have to be identical. So you can't change to different size gears even though you still have the same ratio between those 2 gears.

[matt21]

Would the use of a in-wheel hub planetary gearing be allowed under the rules?
I could not find anything against it.
And as they are part of the unsprung mass and the drive shafts are considered the parts transferring torque from the sprung to the unsprung mass, they could be changed from circuit to circuit and allow for different total ratios.

9.5.1
A gearbox is defined as all the parts in the drive line which transfer torque from the power unit output shaft, as described in Article 5.3.2, to the drive shafts (the drive shafts being defined as those components which transfer drive torque from the sprung mass to the un-sprung mass).
It includes all components whose primary purpose is for the transmission of power or mechanical selection of gears, bearings associated with these components and the casing in which they are housed.

[WhiteBlue]

I doubt that teams want to increase their unsprung mass. Bad news for steering and road holding.

[beelsebob]

I doubt that teams want to increase their unsprung mass. Bad news for steering and road holding.

Would it really increase unsprung mass that significantly though to put a single gear in there, the sole purpose of which would be to multiply the entire gearbox up or down to the relevant track?

That would allow them to happily run both Monaco and Monza gearing, using all 8 gears.