Which exhaust do you take?

[turbof1]

Inspired, not pioneered...

Hence why I choose to use "related". Of course it's guessing from both of us, but I think that Sauber just came up with idea themselves. Red Bull of course obviously copied Sauber in that regard.

[Sevach]

I believe Newey said he always thought of using that solution once his original one was deemed illegal, RedBull never planned to race the "aero neutral" solution.
If you listen to Goss words Mclaren apparently also considered this solution even before the MP4-27 launch.

Just because Sauber was the first to display it doesn't mean everybody copied.
If you think about it, Sauber was on and off with their ramp (apparently now off for good), RedBull is the team that stuck with it all along, the fiddled with it a lot, but ultimately always swore by the solution.

[turbof1]

I believe Newey said he always thought of using that solution once his original one was deemed illegal, RedBull never planned to race the "aero neutral" solution.
If you listen to Goss words Mclaren apparently also considered this solution even before the MP4-27 launch.

Just because Sauber was the first to display it doesn't mean everybody copied.
If you think about it, Sauber was on and off with their ramp (apparently now off for good), RedBull is the team that stuck with it all along, the fiddled with it a lot, but ultimately always swore by the solution.

The original "ramp" was nothing like its current incarnation. It was more like a bridge during testing, which they never got to work. At Valencia they then introduced a sauber-like ramp. He sticked to the concept, but used a totally different piece of bodywork in the end.

[raymondu999]

The original "ramp" was nothing like its current incarnation. It was more like a bridge during testing, which they never got to work. At Valencia they then introduced a sauber-like ramp. He sticked to the concept, but used a totally different piece of bodywork in the end.

If you're saying what I think you're saying, you have it the other way around.

The RB8-B (run from testing, through to China) was basically a Red Bull with the MP4-25 sidepods, but with a slot underneath:


The RB8-C had the slot closed off, and the sidepods became a replica of the MP4-25 (save for the exhaust) until Canada.

Then it became more of a bridge afterwards:


They went from the tunnel being a simple hole in the sidepod, to the ramp basically taking second function and only being a bridge

[wesley123]

Didnt they also ran once without any form of tunnel?

[Sevach]

Only Vettel in China last year, Webber still had ramp.

[wesley123]

I'm not talking about the ramp itself. I'm talking about the ramp without tunnel, I believe it was tried a few times between the -B and -C iic

[Sevach]

The original "ramp" was nothing like its current incarnation.

It was developed, the Mclaren solution has also seem a number of interpretation and changes, among it's huge number of users.

was more like a bridge during testing, which they never got to work.

This is often said but completely incorrect, the RB8-B and C were faster cars than the A version, aka the upgraded versions worked, they weren't as effective as previous RedBull cars but they were good cars that were winning races and setting pole positions.

At Valencia they then introduced a sauber-like ramp. He sticked to the concept, but used a totally different piece of bodywork in the end.

The Valencia spec biggest improvement is widely believed to have little do with the ramp itself but with getting the tunnel underpass to work.

@wesley123 In this case sorry you are correct, they didn't have a tunnel from Bahrain to Canada, it came back on the Valencia spec.

[ringo]

Using the terms "B" and "C" is misleading. It's the same car (chassis) with a few upgrades.

[N12ck]

does look a fair bit like mp4-25 sidepods

[Sevach]

I'm gonna resurrect this in light of recent evolution of STR and Sauber after adopting ramps.

Teams with semi-coanda designs are getting weaker and weaker, with Mercedes hanging on (perhaps for being strong in other areas, suspension for one), while Red Bull is back stroger than ever with the new stronger tires and Lotus looks like the second car on the grid at times.

[Hobbs04]

Due to engine mapping restrictions your really locked into one design direction. Red bull have optimized their maps to the tunnel under ramp. Ferrari are vice versa. I've read the red bull maps for the tunnel design saps a few more horsepower but the gains in df negate that.

[Spacepace]

Have anybody notice the Blue flame of the exhaust this weekend

[Sevach]

Sauber and STR use Ferrari engines and they improved mightly.

[raymondu999]

Due to engine mapping restrictions your really locked into one design direction. Red bull have optimized their maps to the tunnel under ramp. Ferrari are vice versa. I've read the red bull maps for the tunnel design saps a few more horsepower but the gains in df negate that.

Tell that to all the teams that have freely switched back and forth in the past two years. Red Bull, Sauber, STR...