2014-2020 Formula One 1.6l V6 turbo engine formula

[xpensive]

Turbo recovery or not, the energy leaving the engine through the xhaust should be similar, given the amount of fuel burned is the same. What is recovered by the MGU-H will reduce the energy leaving the tailpipe, but that's less interesting.

[rjsa]

When you have a net decrese in fuel consuption the total waste heat will drop. And IMO a lot of the energy recovered by the turbine will be dissipated thru the intercooler.

If you are considering the intercooler as part of the cooling system than yes the overall cooling needs will increase dramatically.

[Tommy Cookers]

presumably the charge cooler is much larger relative to the heat it dumps than is a normal 'radiator'
because the CC temperature difference is much less
similarly so with battery and other electrics cooling maybe ?

so Mr Green has in mind 30% more bulk or cross-sectional area of the cooling systems, not 30% more heat transfer ?

[xpensive]

...
so Mr Green has in mind 30% more bulk or cross-sectional area of the cooling systems, not 30% more heat transfer ?

That would be in line with my view of the typical formula 1 journos' technical understanding.

[wuzak]

I would still suggest that it would be useful to consider the benefits of a water to air intercooler system.

That way the compressed air can have a more direct route to the engine and the radiator would present much less of a problem from an aerodynamic standpoint.

Compare the intercooler radiator intake for the Mosquito (used Merlin 70 series with liquid to air intercooling)






To that of the Lightning (air to air intercooler)

[xpensive]

I would still suggest that it would be useful to consider the benefits of a water to air intercooler system.

That way the compressed air can have a more direct route to the engine and the radiator would present much less of a problem from an aerodynamic standpoint.
...

Remember that the original image of the new Renault engine had a very small intercooler in a very convenient position;



But that was later replaced by an image of a monstrous thing even larger than those for 4-5 bar boost almost 30 years ago,
when someone wisely pointed out that inlet and outlet of the unit didn't even match the core of it either;



As Newey will probably have a lot of say on this, I'm certain that aero will take the front seat and that we will see something much more compact. Besides, the first Renault twin-turbo of 1979 had liquid to air coolers, note the size of the air-inlets;

[ringo]

It will be air to air i feel.
water to air intercooler will require another radiator located somewhere else. Now this can be advantageous if the intercooler is to be placed somewhere else convenient that is not the sidepod.
However i don't see anywhere else on the car where this water to air can go currently, and the weight and space penalty of the radiator is still there.
Had this been a sedan, i could understand that placing the radiator round the back with fans would be advantageous, but with a current F1 car, there just isn't enough body surface to justify a water to air system.

Though i think that area above the tea tray would be a good place to mount a radiator.. then have the water to air intercooler mounted behind the fuel tank or to the side of it.

[piast9]

Isn't a smaller volume of plumbing and intercooler between the compressor and engine intake advantageous in some way?

[xpensive]

What you would do with liquid to air is probably to use the engine's regular cooling circuit somehow, but the only thing that I'm certain of is that Newey's cars will not have that giant intercooler above, neither those gargantuan xhausts, not in this lifetime.

@ piast9; Yes, you would think so, wouldn't you?

[piast9]

@ piast9; Yes, you would think so, wouldn't you?

So air/water intercoolers although heavier may have an advantage because of easier packaging and shorter air plumbing. If that's enough to overcome weight and complexity drawbacks - we'll see. I think the engineers in F1 teams are clever and intelligent people so they thought about it and we'll see the result in about three months time.

[ringo]

It wont be. You will still need a second radiator to cool the water that is cooling the inter cooled air.
This radiators size will be determined by the mass of water in the intercooler circuit.
Shorter air plumbing is the only plus and maybe locating that intercooler somewhere else than the sidepod. However it's the radiator that will have the heated water from the intercooler that will need to be located in the sidepod.

So you basically added another heat exchanger to your system and also more water weight. And you haven't really eliminated the radiator in the sidepod. Not to mention there will be a need for another water pump.

Newey is good, but he's just an employee like anyone else in an f1 team. If Renault give them a sprawled out engine package, he simply has to work with what is given to him.

[xpensive]

...
Newey is good, but he's just an employee like anyone else in an f1 team. If Renault give them a sprawled out engine package, he simply has to work with what is given to him.

I'm not so certain about that last part actually. Moreover, I still suspect that you can integrate the cooling with the engine's.

[Owen.C93]

We might see Drivers squirting their drinks tube over the intercooler for a bit of extra heat reduction next year!

Mercedes ran 4 radiators 2 years ago, 1 on top of another. I wonder if they will still run 2 radiators with an intercooler in front of one. Shouldn't effect the intercooler too much, and might be a better solution if it turns on the water radiator will be larger than the intercooler creating a huge sidepod.

Not that teams are too interested in adding any extra weight this year :/

[rjsa]

What tremperature does the charged air is supposed to reach?

[wuzak]

It wont be. You will still need a second radiator to cool the water that is cooling the inter cooled air.
This radiators size will be determined by the mass of water in the intercooler circuit.
Shorter air plumbing is the only plus and maybe locating that intercooler somewhere else than the sidepod. However it's the radiator that will have the heated water from the intercooler that will need to be located in the sidepod.

The point is that the radiator required for a water to air intercooler system will be smaller than an air to air system of equivalent capacity, and thus will provide an aerodynamic benefit.