Red Bull RB9 Renault

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thisisatest
thisisatest
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Joined: 17 Oct 2010, 00:59

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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i did notice that, and was planning on posting a link to a recording of it, but you beat me to it.
because of what you mention, the stay actually bending in the direction opposite of how it's bent initially, i'm guessing that the upper mounting area is tied to where the wishbone arms, ARB, or torsion bars mount. all that's happening is the mounting point is allowed to tilt slightly, predisposing the stay to bend in a direction. this would make the tea tray more flexible when there is pretty much any cornering going on, such as braking when turning in. they probably found that almost all plank wear happens in high speed corner entry...
just a hypothesis, of course.

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Joined: 12 Mar 2006, 00:27
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Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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I think the initial bend is an optical illusion caused by the camera lense, I would say the stay was perfectly straight and only bends when the car drops.

Manoah2u
Manoah2u
61
Joined: 24 Feb 2013, 14:07

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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SectorOne wrote:Anyone caught Webber´s stop with the camera pointed backwards?

Buckled as he´s coming in, they lift him up then drop him and the stay buckled quite severely.
It definitely looks like it´s connected to the suspension load rather then just the floor hitting the ground but i could be wrong.

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=D> =D> great shot indeed, it is clear that when you look at where the lower wishbone connects to the tub, when the car hits the floor [and thus the suspension comes into motion/under load/pressure], there is a clear transfer of load to the stay - undoubtedly they must be connected in some way.
If my eyes aren't playing tricks, it looks like the stay seems to 'get bent' just around halfway vertical, and indeed, the stay seems to change its 'direction of bending'. Which could suggest that there is some sort of mechanism as to where both [lower] wishbones transfer motion from the suspension onto the stay, in other words, the stay bends to the direction most pressure is being generated - thus would work when the car is turning left, AND would work when the car is turning right,
undoubtedly improving cornering aerodynamics.
Since I believe mechanical or interlinked fysical contact as a mechanism would be a breach of the rules, there could be a hidden air pressure system there - where perhaps the movement of the wishbones connecting into the tub generates enough pressure to bend the stay [like your average houshold bycicle tire pump generates pressure]

thus heating up the t-tray [FIA legality test] will have zero effect, because the t-tray will only move when the stay is under pressure, and the front section of the t-tray as discussed before might consist of e 'flexible' material where it is able to flex upwards.
Then no matter how much pressure is put to the t-tray in a test, as long as the stay is in place, and no [specific] load is put into the stay because the suspension isn't under load, then they will pass scrutineering and thus get a thumbs up as a car that is not proved 'illegal' [which essentially doesn't mean the car is legal, they just can't prove it's illegal].
Last edited by Manoah2u on 18 Nov 2013, 12:59, edited 1 time in total.
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Matt Somers
Matt Somers
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Joined: 19 Mar 2009, 11:33

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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Diesel wrote:I think the initial bend is an optical illusion caused by the camera lense, I would say the stay was perfectly straight and only bends when the car drops.
The pre-buckle is already there (images from different GP's showing it)...

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tuj
tuj
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Joined: 15 Jun 2007, 15:50

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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The pre-buckle is already there (images from different GP's showing it)...
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Just what are we looking at in terms of the white spacer that seems to be protruding?? :shock:

OO7
OO7
171
Joined: 06 Apr 2010, 17:49

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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I don't believe the stay is 'pre-buckled' towards the right (looking at it head on). I think observing the car in profile will show the stay to be banana shaped rather that straight top to bottom. So in profile view, the centre portion of the stay is further from the front wing than the top and bottom ends (due to the curve). The video angle just provides an illusion of the stay being pre-buckled.

OO7
OO7
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010, 17:49

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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SectorOne wrote:Anyone caught Webber´s stop with the camera pointed backwards?

Buckled as he´s coming in, they lift him up then drop him and the stay buckled quite severely.
It definitely looks like it´s connected to the suspension load rather then just the floor hitting the ground but i could be wrong.
I posted something similar back in 2010 on Scarbs' blog:

"I’ve been thinking about how Red Bull could have incorporated a flexing splitter with the RB6.

The connecting stay between the splitter and chassis is also connected to the front suspension internally. As the front suspension is deflected upwards under aero load of the chassis deflecting downwards, it pulls the stay and front tray up via some sort of internal mechanism, thereby acting a little like an active ride system.
Considering how Red bull have developed a front wing that has been designed to flex, it may not be so far fetched that they’ve done the same with the splitter and some internal mounts.
So perhaps the connecting stay and part of the front suspension is connected to an internal support that flexes."


The idea was that the internal carbon fibre mount connecting the suspension and stay would be flexible under load. I don't believe this is the case however.

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Shrieker
13
Joined: 01 Mar 2010, 23:41

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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SectorOne wrote:Anyone caught Webber´s stop with the camera pointed backwards?

Buckled as he´s coming in, they lift him up then drop him and the stay buckled quite severely.
It definitely looks like it´s connected to the suspension load rather then just the floor hitting the ground but i could be wrong.

I´ll try and get a gif up.

Edit:

http://i.imgur.com/qhisuOD.gif

Also notice it´s bent one direction yet during load it bends the other way.
Surely there´s less resistance in the already bent direction?
Like if you have a card between your thumb and finger and bend it slightly.
Then try get it to bend the other direction.
I think this is the most exciting thing coming out of the USGP weekend lol.

You've struck gold there. I agree the buckling is definitely in conjunction with the lower wishbone load. Red Bull are caught red handed again.
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OO7
OO7
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010, 17:49

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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Shrieker wrote:You've struck gold there. I agree the buckling is definitely in conjunction with the lower wishbone load. Red Bull are caught red handed again.
I'm not so sure. The buckling looks to me to occur as the plank touches the ground. Also there appears to be suspension jounce oscillation (although this could be caused by light reflections) that are not replicated by the buckle.

radosav
radosav
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Joined: 05 Feb 2012, 20:46

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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If you look at ' Rauch ' logo and suspension parts you can se that suspension moves extremely because car was thrown on track ,and by doing it splitter hit the ground and therefore movement of the buckling ! I believe that buckling curved formation and because it can rotate around vertical axis , so it gives false look of some kind of trick going on!

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Shrieker
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Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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Blaze1 wrote:I'm not so sure. The buckling looks to me to occur as the plank touches the ground. Also there appears to be suspension jounce oscillation (although this could be caused by light reflections) that are not replicated by the buckle.
It doesn't look like the tea tray is touching the ground upon landing.
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radosav
radosav
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Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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Sorry for edit issue ,i am writing this on my mobile phone!

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Redragon
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Joined: 24 May 2011, 12:23

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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I think if we can have a footage of the pit stop so we can analyze which side of the car touch the floor first, would be great.

If the four wheels touch the floor at same time, it might be that the T-tray bends because touches the floor but if the right side wheels or left side wheels touch first than the other one, we could determinate if the t-tray bends on the direction of the wheels that touch first. Before any conclusions.

If i understood well how the system works.

OO7
OO7
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Joined: 06 Apr 2010, 17:49

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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Shrieker wrote:
Blaze1 wrote:I'm not so sure. The buckling looks to me to occur as the plank touches the ground. Also there appears to be suspension jounce oscillation (although this could be caused by light reflections) that are not replicated by the buckle.
It doesn't look like the tea tray is touching the ground upon landing.
Because of the plank underneath I guess.

Yurasyk
Yurasyk
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Joined: 31 Jan 2013, 20:39

Re: Red Bull RB9 Renault

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