2013 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos

[Sevach]

Hamilton changed his line in the braking zone, that should be enough to tell you who is responsible for the collision.

[ringo]

As Davidson showed on the 'Skypad', Hamilton was looking in his left mirror whilst Bottas was on his right side. He didn't know where Bottas was and drifted into him. If Bottas had been able to carry on then Hamilton may have gotten away with a reprimand after the race but as it was, castiron penalty.

Bottas has a steering wheel in his hand, he was the one with the best seat in the house. Simply poor driving from him.
he doesn't get a free pass. Hamilton was defending against him, but if Hamilton did defend and move to the right, it would have been perfectly legal.
Bottas simply isn't that good under braking and attacking. That's all i saw with that accident. He can't even pass a driver who isn't even aware of him.

[ringo]

The rule states leaving a one car width between you and the edge of the track. That is the minimum expected from a defending driver. However, it does not give the defending driver the right to push off the other one even if he complied with that rule. The rule gives the defending driver a duty he must comply with; it does not give him any rights. The rule isn't a freepass for evoking race incident.

I see both points as valid. I just re-watched a replay of the clash and it's just rather unfortunate; I'm not entirely sure, but they collided by a milimeter of margins - just as Hamilton hits Bottas, he was just about turning in that would have made him move away from Bottas again.

What's also worth pointing out, is that Hamiltons direction was already pointing towards the racing line when Bottas wasn't along side him yet - and from there he was moving slightly outwards until he was going to turn into his apex. In other words, Bottas was already well aware that the gap was shrinking as he pulled up besides Hamilton. Now, maybe Bottas turned in ever so slighty too early or Hamilton too late. What I do find a bit unfortunate is that Bottas did have more space to use to avoid contact, yet he didn't. At some point, when you move up on someone on the outside, there is always the chance that your fellow opponent might not see you, not know you are there or simply might drift outwards if he is on the limit of his grip - which is why the inside of a corner is always the place you want to be when overtaking someone and overtaking someone is always riskier on the outside and requires a fair amount of fairplay and respect from your opponent (assuming he knows you are there).

It was unwise of Bottas to put himself there - and unwise of Hamilton to not be aware that Bottas had effectively pulled up next to him. It's also probably unfortunate since Bottas wasn't an opponent - he was a lap down. So he probably didn't expect Bottas to suddenly show up there - on quicker tyres or not. In that sense, it was different to the Kobayashi incident in Spa when Hamilton was overtaking someone he was racing for position (but moved over too soon).

Given that there was space on Bottas side, I would have called it a racing incident. I think Hamilton driving around the track with a puncture was already quite damaging enough and didn't require an additional penalty. Just all very unfortunate, for both.

I like the video, very clear. Bottas wasn't using his head. In normal circumstances a driver would ease over to the right if he's being squeezed. And in no way was he even being pressured to the edge, he had more than enough room to brake and take the undercut on hamilton into the corner.
I say even if hamilton was aware of him and wanted to squeeze him to a car's width, it would have been perfectly legal.

Someone should point out in that video, what Hamilton is doing differently than any other defensive single move. It doesn't look any different than any other defense to me, and it doesn't even look one tenth as harsh. Bottas was just sleeping during the overtake. Had he been awake he would would have gone further right and do a cross over on lewis.

[ringo]

Coulthards comment's were hilarious, "bottas did have room to move out the way" que? let it be known lesser drivers, if Hamilton turns into your line, you should move to the edge of the track...

What line? are you serious. there is no such regulation as a line that belongs to a car.

I agree fully with David. Move to the edge when the Boss is coming through.

Your line goes as far as your front wing. It doesn't exist anywhere ahead of that. And for that reason a driver can defend against you by placing his car anywhere in front of you in one decisive move.
I say these kinds of debates usually are pointless, especially when dealing with those who don't know the sporting code.

This whole racing line idea is simply wrong. No part of the track belongs to any driver, especially not a line.
You drive where there is room, so long as you have one car's width, and that there are no sudden movements from the defender. This freedom of movement in a space is especially true for the attacking driver.
He has more responsibility than the one being attacked as he has more choice. It is for this reason why we rarely see hamilton engage in an incident when he's the attacking driver. He knows how to attack and use the track width.

If you ask Bottas when did he expect Hamilton to use his single defensive move, i can bet you that he has no answer because he didn't even consider it. So you can imagine how worse it would have been had Lewis tried to actually defend?

This just shows that bottas is not ready for the big leagues or wheel to wheel racing.

[FW17]

If you ask Bottas when did he expect Hamilton to use his single defensive move, i can bet you that he has no answer because he didn't even consider it. So you can imagine how worse it would have been had Lewis tried to actually defend?

Do'nt think 1 defensive move includes a bump

[Hail22]

I'm not weighing into this debate, however I'll leave this here for people who didn't see the contact and are drawing question marks

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ynAI-Ypp7Y[/youtube]

[Arterius]

Coulthards comment's were hilarious, "bottas did have room to move out the way" que? let it be known lesser drivers, if Hamilton turns into your line, you should move to the edge of the track...

What line? are you serious. there is no such regulation as a line that belongs to a car.

I agree fully with David. Move to the edge when the Boss is coming through.

Your line goes as far as your front wing. It doesn't exist anywhere ahead of that. And for that reason a driver can defend against you by placing his car anywhere in front of you in one decisive move.
I say these kinds of debates usually are pointless, especially when dealing with those who don't know the sporting code.

This whole racing line idea is simply wrong. No part of the track belongs to any driver, especially not a line.
You drive where there is room, so long as you have one car's width, and that there are no sudden movements from the defender. This freedom of movement in a space is especially true for the attacking driver.
He has more responsibility than the one being attacked as he has more choice. It is for this reason why we rarely see hamilton engage in an incident when he's the attacking driver. He knows how to attack and use the track width.

If you ask Bottas when did he expect Hamilton to use his single defensive move, i can bet you that he has no answer because he didn't even consider it. So you can imagine how worse it would have been had Lewis tried to actually defend?

This just shows that bottas is not ready for the big leagues or wheel to wheel racing.

Utter Hamilton Fanboy nonsense.

[Richard]

We know its time to close the thread when we have frame by frame analysis, cries of unfairness and replays of Turkey 2010.

Stuff happens. Time to move on.