2014 - Exhaust Exits

[TechNewbie]

In 2013 season we saw the Coanada exhaust system used with most/all teams, with an exit point towards the back end of the sidepods area each side. I seem to be getting a little confused with the jargon/regulations a bit here so I just have a couple of questions:

1) Can teams still have an exhaust output on each side or is it one single point of entry near the rear axel ?
2) Is their a third output that goes through the role hoop(above drivers head) and then exits just above/near the beam wing(2013) season, so could they direct this into the diffuser area/starter hole for 2014 season ? Also could someone clarify the different outputs(what they do ? or how many ?)
3) Is it possible that we could see slots/channels in the sides/middle of rear wings and direct airflow towards gap between rear tyre and floor ?
4) Also with loss of the rear beam for the 2014 season where would teams find the down force from ?

Any comments/answers would be much appreciated...

Regards

[Huntresa]

The exhaust must exit within a regulated box in one single pipe almost under the rear wing, angled from 0 to 5 degrees.

Like this pic, red area is today and yellow area is where the one pipe needs to exit next year.

[Holm86]

I actually thought the exhaust had to be exactly in the centerline of the car. But then I found this.

5.8.4 The last 150mm of any tailpipe must in its entirety :
a) Form a thin-walled unobstructed right circular cylinder with its axis +/- 5° to the car centre line when viewed from above the car and between 0° and 5° (tail up) to the reference plane when viewed from the side of the car. The entire circumference of the exit should lie on a single plane normal to the tailpipe axis and be located at the rearmost extremity of the last 150mm of the tailpipe.
b) Be located between 350mm and 550mm above the reference plane.
c) Be located no more than 100mm from the car centre line.
d) Be positioned in order that the entire circumference of the exit of the tailpipe lies between two vertical planes normal to the car centre line and which lie between 170mm and 185mm rearward of the rear wheel centre line.

So could we see offset/assymetrical exhausts?? For instance the exhaust exiting in the left side of the car at tracks that is run clock-wise and in the right side when the track is anti clock-wise? Or vise versa I dont know what would be optimal.

But i seem to remember that McLaren did run not only assymetric sidepod intakes but also assymetric exhaust exit hole sizes a few years back.

This would keep the exhaust outlets in the "shielded" side during yaw and keep the "clean" side free of exhaust openings etc.

[Blackout]

What about the wastegate (if there is one)? I read the regulations (not everything though : p) but as I understnad it, the wastagte can have its own exhaust pipe/doesnt need to be merged with the main exhaust outlet. Am I wrong ?

And what about the blow off valve ?

[Holm86]

What about the wastegate (if there is one)? I read the regulations (not everything though : p) but as I understnad it, the wastagte can have its own exhaust pipe/doesnt need to be merged with the main exhaust outlet. Am I wrong ?

And what about the blow off valve ?

If there will be a wastegate it cant have its own exhaust exit.

5.8.2 Engine exhaust systems must have only a single tailpipe exit which must be rearward facing and through which all exhaust gases must pass.

Im not quite sure about the blow-off.

But I suggested something earlier this year which would also remove much of the need of running a blow-off valve.


I suggested that they should run cold blowing of the engine if that is allowed in 2014. This means when the driver lifts off the throttle pedal the throttle plates should open 100% instead of closing as normal. This would keep a higher flow through the turbo so you can harvest more energy with the MGU-H. It would decrease pumping losses which would decrease natural engine braking effect which allows the MGU-K to harvest a larger procentage during braking. And last it would prevent the shockwave moving backward from the throttleplate to the compressor when the throttleplate closes. The fuel and ignition would off course be cut.

IMO it should be legal as there is no aerodynamic advantage from cold blowing next year with the new exhaust exit regulations.

[wuzak]

What about the wastegate (if there is one)? I read the regulations (not everything though : p) but as I understnad it, the wastagte can have its own exhaust pipe/doesnt need to be merged with the main exhaust outlet. Am I wrong ?

On exhaust pipe means one exhaust pipe. A wastegate would have to exit through that one exhaust pipe.

And what about the blow off valve ?

Not sure that there will be one fitted.

The rules require all air that enters the compressor must exit the exhaust - barring minor leaks at manifold joints.

[Holm86]

And what about the blow off valve ?

Not sure that there will be one fitted.

The rules require all air that enters the compressor must exit the exhaust - barring minor leaks at manifold joints.

This is correct. It does not remove the possibility of a blow-off though. The blow-off could vent out into the exhaust. I think some old rally cars used this technique in their anti-lag systems.
But yeah you would not be able to run those fast and furious style loud whistle blow-off valves that just vent into the atmosphere.

Here is a diagram.

[thisisatest]

some road cars, such as my 2001 audi s4, use this arrangement. they call it a diverter valve instead of a blow-off valve. here, they are either a diaphragm or spring loaded plates, no computer/solenoid control, although im sure f1 would be more sophisticated about it.

[Holm86]

some road cars, such as my 2001 audi s4, use this arrangement. they call it a diverter valve instead of a blow-off valve. here, they are either a diaphragm or spring loaded plates, no computer/solenoid control, although im sure f1 would be more sophisticated about it.

The reason there is a solenoid is because you can switch the anti-lag on and off.

I'm pretty sure your S4 does not use a similar system. It uses a recirculated valve instead. Leading the compressed air back into the intake before the turbocharger. I don't think any standard road car leads the boost pressure straight into the exhaust??

[thisisatest]

yep, youre right.
ive had it wrong in my head this whole time. oh well, live and learn.

[Holm86]

yep, youre right.
ive had it wrong in my head this whole time. oh well, live and learn.

Well its easy to get a bit confused And learning is what this forum is all about right.

[Harsha]

Excuse me for being a Noob but i heard that in next year there will be Lag what kind of lag it will be?

[wuzak]

Excuse me for being a Noob but i heard that in next year there will be Lag what kind of lag it will be?

I doubt that there will be any lag, since the turbo will be hooked up to a motor/generator unit which will be able to spin the turbo up to speed if and when necessary.

[Xwang]

What about the wastegate (if there is one)? I read the regulations (not everything though : p) but as I understnad it, the wastagte can have its own exhaust pipe/doesnt need to be merged with the main exhaust outlet. Am I wrong ?

And what about the blow off valve ?

If there will be a wastegate it cant have its own exhaust exit.

5.8.2 Engine exhaust systems must have only a single tailpipe exit which must be rearward facing and through which all exhaust gases must pass.

Im not quite sure about the blow-off.

But I suggested something earlier this year which would also remove much of the need of running a blow-off valve.


I suggested that they should run cold blowing of the engine if that is allowed in 2014. This means when the driver lifts off the throttle pedal the throttle plates should open 100% instead of closing as normal. This would keep a higher flow through the turbo so you can harvest more energy with the MGU-H. It would decrease pumping losses which would decrease natural engine braking effect which allows the MGU-K to harvest a larger procentage during braking. And last it would prevent the shockwave moving backward from the throttleplate to the compressor when the throttleplate closes. The fuel and ignition would off course be cut.

IMO it should be legal as there is no aerodynamic advantage from cold blowing next year with the new exhaust exit regulations.

Is the gas which exits from wastegate an "exhaust gas" or only a compressed gas?

[dren]

The wastegate dumps exhaust gas. It is used to regulate boost pressure by regulating how much exhaust gas flows through the turbine side of the turbo. Since there is a motor/generator attached to the turbo, it will load up and regulate turbo speed and boost.

A blow off valve dumps compressed intake air when you lift off throttle so the turbo stays spooled. The motor generator can spool the turbo, so not sure if there will be much of a need for a blow off valve.