McLaren MP4-29 Mercedes

[Forza]

Jerez -Test 1- Day 2

[i70q7m7ghw]

McLaren Vs Williams, drive shafts for reference:-

[H2H]

Personally I would be surprised if we see those paddles on any circuit, I guess that the drag penalty is just too high for anything like Monza but if it works it will be used in the street races. If the L/D is too inefficient it will be a bigger penalty then in the former F1 periods as those were not as fuel-limited. In this sense downforce efficiency is in general more important then ever.

With all due respect, I don't understand why Macca would go to the trouble of hundreds, if not thousands of man hours figuring a way to get the suspension arms so incredibly far back that you could puff them up and they would look just like that…and then not use them ever in the season one time.

Edit: not to mention the entire flow of the side pods is shaped to exit right above them!!

I worded that part of my post in the opposite way I intended it.

I have no doubt that, legality permitting, they will use it during the season, but I think that in the case of Monza and maybe some others the L/D ratio might just be too small. As I wrote those butterflies are an integral part of the design philosophy as one can see by the rear mounting parts and the side pod design.

It is important to point out that one should be careful to avoid to get carried away in any direction. I love the technical idea, kudos to the guys who designed it but it is difficult to gauge it's importance right now. It should work considerably better in races like Monaco which are high-downforce and not as fuel-limited as Monza. I guess we will have to wait for the first relatively low downforce and more fuel-limited track to see if the prediction is correct. At least Monza, I hope, will prove my point.

[i70q7m7ghw]

I worded that part of my post in the opposite way I intended it.

I have no doubt that, legality permitting, they will use it during the season, but I think that in the case of Monza and maybe some others the L/D ratio might just be too small. As I wrote those butterflies are an integral part of the design philosophy as one can see by the rear mounting parts and the side pod design.

It is important to point out that one should be careful to avoid to get carried away in any direction. I love the technical idea, kudos to the guys who designed it but it is difficult to gauge it's importance right now. It should work considerably better in races like Monaco which are high-downforce and not as fuel-limited as Monza. I guess we will have to wait for the first relatively low downforce and more fuel-limited track to see if the prediction is correct. At least Monza, I hope, will prove my point.

There's nothing to stop them putting slim wish bones on for the low DF races.

[aral]

There's nothing to stop them putting slim wish bones on for the low DF races.

Other than the fact that they would have to redesign all aero at the back end to deal with the changed airflow!

[i70q7m7ghw]

There's nothing to stop them putting slim wish bones on for the low DF races.

Other than the fact that they would have to redesign all aero at the back end to deal with the changed airflow!

I wouldn't have thought so. The wish bones are aero neutral, so they aren't going to have a massive effect.

[Mr.G]

There's nothing to stop them putting slim wish bones on for the low DF races.

Other than the fact that they would have to redesign all aero at the back end to deal with the changed airflow!

I wouldn't have thought so. The wish bones are aero neutral, so they aren't going to have a massive effect.

They are neutral for them self not for the whole package. If they works as described/speculated, they have quite a lot of influence on how the diffuser works. So they will have effect...

[i70q7m7ghw]

Other than the fact that they would have to redesign all aero at the back end to deal with the changed airflow!

I wouldn't have thought so. The wish bones are aero neutral, so they aren't going to have a massive effect.

They are neutral for them self not for the whole package. If they works as described/speculated, they have quite a lot of influence on how the diffuser works. So they will have effect...

Yes, but what we are discussing is using slimmer wishbones to remove that effect, so a low DF configuration.

[ElDictatore]

There's nothing to stop them putting slim wish bones on for the low DF races.

Other than the fact that they would have to redesign all aero at the back end to deal with the changed airflow!

Didn't they mention somewhere that they have a more conventional back-up solution?

[R_Redding]

I can't imagine that the big teams will complain to the FIA against this idea. Ok..it may give McLaren a 3 month advantage but it is a solution to the missing beam wing that they all face,and with redesign could use.

Had the Max and Bernie show still been in charge,it would have been banned instantly...especially now that Ron is back in charge. Max and Bernie never forgave Ron for trying to stop them gaining power ,so they were always strict with McLaren.
And with McLaren attracting Honda back into the fold,the FIA and Todt especially will not want to be seen to go back on their original decision that it is legal.

Rob

[F1T]

A closer look at McLaren's bufferfly suspension - Development blog

McLaren have come up with the first real innovation of the year by creating rear suspension wishbones that are very different to what we usually see. It is the normal approach to have a horizontal teardrop design, almost parallel to the reference plane in order to minimize drag created by the suspension elements. McLaren's version though as just a bit different.

The team's approach is far away from drag reduction. Instead, the elements are rather big with a cross section similar to a mushroom lying down on its side. Before we see how it works, it needs to be noted that the design has already been cleared as legal by the FIA. This means that the entire shape is structural, as otherwise the thick fairing would be considered as banned moving bodywork as per Article 10.3.4 of the Technical Regulations.

Article 10.3.1 further stipulate limitations to the cross section of the suspension arms, saying its longest dimension (main axis) may not be move than 100mm, and this axis can only be up to 5° off from being parallel to the reference plane. On top of that, the section must also be parallel among its main axis.

So, what McLaren have done is create a wishbone in the shape of a bell on its side. It's length is likely to be very close or exactly 100mm, while the height looks to be of similar dimension. This means the section has an aspect ration of close to 1:1, must less than the maximum allowed 3.5:1, therefore making the entire part legal.

To make it aerodynamically more interesting, the axis is then rotated by 5 degrees, so that the backside of the bell pulls air upwards, rather then be aerodynamically neutral. [...]

[i70q7m7ghw]

The team's approach is far away from drag reduction. Instead, the elements are rather big with a cross section similar to a mushroom lying down on its side.

IMO, this is not correct. I believe they are just large rounded square in profile.

[Del Boy]

Not a technical question but valid I think. Are the McLaren team making a great effort to hide the rear suspension when the car stops, in other words are all the pictures when it's running?

[mclaren_mircea]

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 17312.html

Another article of AMUS about Mclaren's rear wing... the verdict: it's completely legal. Here the english translation: "The new McLaren MP4-29 has the designers of the competition concerned. Everyone looked at the photos of the new rear axle. It is now clear: it is absolutely legal.To make it short: The new McLaren MP4-29 is legal. The engineers in Woking were just clever. While all the world is still bothered because the new nose rule was reduced to absurdity, McLaren has tricked at the other end of the car. "

[RZS10]

To me it rather looks like a dragonfly, not like a butterfly