2014 Testing - Bahrain 19-22 Feb

[NathanOlder]

But Turns 5,6,7 11&12 are all fast enough, so its not true to say Bahrain has no high speed turns.
Turn 7 is around the 220kph mark which is on par with Becketts and faster than Stowe.

[autogyro]

Since the F1 cars do not contain a starter motor they won't be running only on the MGU-K. Cylinder shutdown is AFAIK allowed in 2014 so theoretically they should be able to turn off a few cylinders and run predominantly with the MGU-K.

The MGU-K is basically a very powerful starter motor. You just cut injection for all cylinders at the start of the pitlane and restart them a few meters before the end-pit-limiter line. Since the crankshaft is turning at that point (by power from the MGU-K) the restarting is nothing more than starting injection and ignition. This has been done by Toyota in the Prius since 2004 and many hybrids after that.

The Prius uses a planetary gear set with multiple inputs/outputs, it does not compare to sticking a big starter motor/generator on the nose of the crank as in F1,
The crank nose placement is a 19th century concept, replaced by the ring gear system to reduce load in starter systems.
If the ERS-Kinetic MG system had been positioned at a more sensible place on the power train, Fi cars could indeed use electrical power both in the pits and for faster initial acceleration from the start line.
They would have found it far easier to balance the rear brakes and deceleration energy recovery as well.
As it is, to use electrical power on its own F1 cars have to spin up a redundant IC engine which wastes energy and fuel.
Apparently on the Renault power train using this method and the MG positioning also puts undue strain on the poor IC engine, its crankshaft and crankcase then have major problems dealing with this new high energy input applied to its structure.
Still at least 2014 is a new direction for F1 even if it is a bit basic.
Adding extra computer control will help sort the problems but at the expense of reducing driver feel and skill input.
We can hope that all this might result in a sensible change in direction for the technology but I have my doubts.

[dougskullery]

I doubt Mercedes would have as much downforce as Mclaren. Brackley's car have a tighter coke-bottle than Mclaren but not that much more, and their nose probably doesn't help it either. Then, the Mclaren has a very significant advantage with their lower wishbones...

Making judgments about downforce based purely on appearances is a bad idea at the best of times. How can you say which nose has a better impact on the car's overall downforce? And as for judging a car's downforce on the tightness of the coke bottle, remember the Williams from a couple of years ago? The car was virtually non-existent behind the sidepods, but it was still a dog on track.

And if we're playing the 'which car looks like it generates more downforce' game, how about the levels of rake Mercedes can run? That's one of the best indicators of how a car is performing aerodynamically, and the W05 is running with almost as much rake as the 2013 Red Bull. And that's a far less draggy way to generate downforce than McLaren's mushroom suspension, and in a fuel-saving formula drag can be a killer.

[turbof1]

That all said, I doubt Mercedes would have as much downforce as Mclaren. Brackley's car have a tighter coke-bottle than Mclaren but not that much more, and their nose probably doesn't help it either. Then, the Mclaren has a very significant advantage with their lower wishbones...

I very much doubt that. Clear signs came from the laptimes, where mercedes was 1.5s faster than mclaren's best while being on a one step inferior tyre. Testing times do start getting relevant now, especially for those 2, being the 2 most reliable teams. Mercedes overall just looks faster.

I think mercedes get to extract more performance from the diffuser, since they have the confidence to run the amount of rake that matches pre-2014 ones.

[Artur Craft]

But Turns 5,6,7 11&12 are all fast enough, so its not true to say Bahrain has no high speed turns.
Turn 7 is around the 220kph mark which is on par with Becketts and faster than Stowe.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_ggwTnqhqk

Right from Rosberg's pole of last year:(I'm counting only real corners and not the official corner numbers)
Corner Speed (kmh)
1 - 69
2 - 108
3 - 182
4 - 76
5 - 76 yes, 76 again
6 - 147
7 - 133
8 - 123

There are some mid-speed corners there, that's all. All corners are taken under 200kmh, even "T7".

Downforce is a little bit important on corner 6 and relevant on corner 3. But it's not a dominant thing in any.

Besisdes these two mid-speed corners, all others are very slow ones.

This track is all about straight speed and good mechanical grip. Remember how well the poor downforce Mclaren of 2009 did at this track?!

Mercedes has been very good on straight line speeds in recent years, as well as in mechanical grip. I'll believe Mercedes have more df than Mclaren only if they outqualify them on a track like Barcelona, or at least Sepang

Anyway, cheers

PS: I did not see many videos but I have not seen Mercedes running similar levels of rake as Red Bull ran until last year, for instance.
PS2: I know there is a lot more to compose laptimes than superficial and apparent peaces on the car's bodywork such as tightness of coke-bottle and etc. Still, that's all we have to make our guesses

[NathanOlder]

On that video he hits turn 7 apex at 215kph. Turn 7 being the left hander in the 5,6,7 combo. Flick left, then right then left. Leading to 8 the final right hander before the back straight that runs parallel with the start/finish straight.

[Blanchimont]

Don't underestimate the corner 2 at 160km/h from the Rosberg video, i think it is very close to the lateral limit of the car.
Then 6 at 185km/h and 7 at 215km/h, braking for corner 10 through 9 from 250km/h. Corner 12 with a speed of 250 seems also close the lateral limit to me.

[vtr]

Have you guys seen the Caterham telemetry data they have in their (really good) site?

Here's the one for Bahrain

Yes, it's the Caterham, not a top car, and we don't know the conditions of the car when the data was acquired, but the telemetry they provide can provide a nice reference.
We can see that turn 2 is a very strong corner g-wise as Blanchimont said, the telemetry car did turn 6 at 167km/h and 7 at 192 km/h. Turn 9 has very high lateral g as well before the car brakes. Turn 12 is the one with the most lateral g, taken at around 250km/h flat out.

[sAx]

Day 4 summary including Raikkonen's off:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNcZQpSmizs[/youtube]

Apologies for any cross-posting.

[Crabbia]

Have you guys seen the Caterham telemetry data they have in their (really good) site?

Here's the one for Bahrain http://caterhamf1.com/previews/2013/04- ... H-Full.png

Yes, it's the Caterham, not a top car, and we don't know the conditions of the car when the data was acquired, but the telemetry they provide can provide a nice reference.
We can see that turn 2 is a very strong corner g-wise as Blanchimont said, the telemetry car did turn 6 at 167km/h and 7 at 192 km/h. Turn 9 has very high lateral g as well before the car brakes. Turn 12 is the one with the most lateral g, taken at around 250km/h flat out.

Really cool thanks for finding and posting this man.

Would be good to hang onto this to compare it to this years cars when some telemetry from this year become available. Probably next year some time.

[Postmoe]

I think the point here is not so much about one or 2 turns with high demands in terms of DF, but around the fact that Bahrain is a traction straight speed circuit overall.

I think it is very unlikely to get 3 seconds advantage from 2 turns in a wide Tilke circuit.

As said previously, I would initially bet for a superior traction management from Mercedes, which implies suspension and power delivery with a bonus given by slow speed rear DF. A marginal bonus given the fact we don't have EBD anymore.

[the EDGE]

That all said, I doubt Mercedes would have as much downforce as Mclaren. Brackley's car have a tighter coke-bottle than Mclaren but not that much more, and their nose probably doesn't help it either. Then, the Mclaren has a very significant advantage with their lower wishbones...

I very much doubt that. Clear signs came from the laptimes, where mercedes was 1.5s faster than mclaren's best while being on a one step inferior tyre. Testing times do start getting relevant now, especially for those 2, being the 2 most reliable teams. Mercedes overall just looks faster.

I think mercedes get to extract more performance from the diffuser, since they have the confidence to run the amount of rake that matches pre-2014 ones.

I aslo feel Mercedes could be slightly faster at present however According to Sky http://www1.skysports.com/f1/news/22058 ... at-bahrain, Jenson also did a 1:34.9 on new softs on the last day too.

Mercedes did say that they run several qualifying sims to get this time and were pushing, so the real question is did they hold anything back?

McLaren are at least 1 day testing behind Merc due to the installation issues on day 1 of Jerez and are probably still to really go for it, in a normal GP weekend its quite common for teams to go 2 seconds faster in q3 as oppose to free practice and often q1&2 too, so im going to reserve judgement on outright pace until Melbourne

Fastest laps of Bahrain Test One
1. Nico Rosberg, Mercedes, 1:33.283, New Soft tyres, Day Four.
2. Lewis Hamilton, Mercedes, 1:34.263, New soft tyres, Day Three.
3. Kevin Magnussen, McLaren, 1:34.910, New supersoft tyres, Day Two.
4. Jenson Button, McLaren, 1:34.957, New soft tyres, Day Four.
5. Nico Hulkenberg, Force India, 1:36.445, New soft tyres, Day Two.
6. Fernando Alonso, Ferrari, 1:36.516, Used soft tyres, Day Two.
7. Kimi Raikkonen, Ferrari, 1:36.718, New soft tyres, Day Four.
8. Felipe Massa, Williams, 1:37.066, New soft tyres, Day Three.
9. Esteban Gutierrez, Sauber, 1:37.180, Unknown tyre compound, Day Three
10. Valtteri Bottas, Williams, 1:37.328, Unknown tyre compound, Day Two.

[Blackout]

In day three Rosberg told to AMuS that he will do a 1:32.9 the following day. But he couldnt in day 4 and he argued that he did a mistake in the last turn and that his W05 was carriying the max heat bodywork spec, so he says he lost 3 tenths.

[NTS]

Although thinking about that I'm sure the teams would still want good acceleration off the line from stationary after the pit stop itself, and the MGUK by itself would give a sluggish pull off in comparison to the ICE + MGUK. So if anything i think they would run on MGUK from the pitlane limiter line to the stop, at the stop restart the ICE and then pull off with the ICE.

Considering this i think they would most likely run on predominantly MGUK at maxion mentioned with possibly the ICE having 2 cylinders shut down.

I still think people make too much of starting and stopping an ICE. With proper computer control you can run with zero injection from limiter to stop. Then start injection at the exact same time as taking off from the stop and cut injection immediately if you reach the limiter speed. Starting and stopping and ICE while you have some other source of power on the crankshaft (MGU-K, but also for your standard car: motion from the wheels) is not really technically different from cylinder cutting, just applied to all cylinders.

In any normal roadcar with direct injection engine, if you take your foot of the accelerator while slowing down it will kill injection completely and restart it when you reach the idle RPM or depress the clutch. Nobody ever notices this, there is no gap in power delivery.

So there is no reason to "maybe cut 2 cylinders", just stop injection entirely and save some fuel for the actual racing.

[NathanOlder]

Don't underestimate the corner 2 at 160km/h from the Rosberg video, i think it is very close to the lateral limit of the car.
Then 6 at 185km/h and 7 at 215km/h, braking for corner 10 through 9 from 250km/h. Corner 12 with a speed of 250 seems also close the lateral limit to me.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... ut.svg.png

Thankyou, I thought I was the only one seeing these corners as challenging fast corners.