whats wrong with the renault engines?

[motobaleno]

There is no need for Renault to panick over Homologation.

The appendix 4 Homologation chart is very generous and gives them years before major items changes are locked in ,to the point where they need to consult with the other engine manufacturers.
They can still change 61kgs of the weighed 66kgs total upto 2016
This is the current Homologation schedule ....

http://i897.photobucket.com/albums/ac18 ... f756e3.jpg

http://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/ ... -01-23.pdf

Rob

Yes, but I think that all those items can be changed for the next year. not during this one...otherwise the very term "homologation" looses sense (and infact appendix 4 in the colums says "for" not "until")

[rjsa]

In another Forum, an insider (thats for sure) gave a fantastic information about the Renault issues and how they will solve them:

For those interested. Here are some of the changes Renault have made since Jerez.

Change of battery cell provider...

That's the second 'insider' over there. The first one didn't survive lat weeks test, his fixes didn't work. Lets see what happens now.

It seems all was no good after all.

[Juzh]

There is no need for Renault to panick over Homologation.

The appendix 4 Homologation chart is very generous and gives them years before major items changes are locked in ,to the point where they need to consult with the other engine manufacturers.
They can still change 61kgs of the weighed 66kgs total upto 2016
This is the current Homologation schedule ....

http://i897.photobucket.com/albums/ac18 ... f756e3.jpg

http://www.fia.com/sites/default/files/ ... -01-23.pdf

Rob

Yes, but I think that all those items can be changed for the next year. not during this one...otherwise the very term "homologation" looses sense (and infact appendix 4 in the colums says "for" not "until")

From JAonF1:

If one of the power trains is performing significantly worse than the others, can the manufacturrer apply for a performance upgrade?
Not in principle. However if that situation arises it is clearly not in the interests of the sport so some common sense needs to be applied. The rule makers looked at this and pre-empted it in some ways; they decided that all manufacturers should be allowed to make a small number of performance upgrades after one year, so the engines will be re-homologated this time next year. And in 2016 there will be a smaller list of areas where they can make further performance steps.

The spirit of this rule (rather like any innovation in chassis design a team introduces which others cannot copy) is that if one manufacturer has the edge he should be allowed to enjoy the fruits of his hard work for a season, but then the others will be allowed to close up next season. But if there is one manufacturer lagging behind, then what happens?

[Kiril Varbanov]

Strategy group meeting today, Renault has asked for deadline extension.

[oT v1]

Strategy group meeting today, Renault has asked for deadline extension.

and of course they'll get it, 'too big to fail' comes to mind, shows a weakness of having 3 engine suppliers sharing the entire field. I hope Merc and Ferrari reignited their engine development when they saw renault struggling, foreseeing an extension...

[CBeck113]

I posted that exact thought in the Scudderia thread, that the comment from Stefano about being 75 hp behind Mercedes was made to motivate Renault into asking for the extension, so they can add some late, new ideas.

[FrukostScones]

AMuS article on Renault asking for extened deadline:

http://translate.google.de/translate?sl ... ml&act=url



I blame this on not testing the engines in mules beforhand. Ridiculous that this wasn't (allowed?) done extensively!

Now we have this probably damaging scenario for Renault and the sport. It is not worth argueing that they didn't do their homework... F1 cannot afford to exile Renault, while Honda can gain Mercedes data and steal their engineers (they do) and can develop a more powerful copycat Mercedes PU for 2015 while using mules (yes, they will do this even if they deny it here: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/108796).

[DAMNINice]

BREAKING NEWS from AMuS about Renault engines..

short version translated:

The deadline for engine suppliers when they have to give the engine to the FIA for Homologation is tonight.

Renault told at the weekend that they have sorted out the biggest problems. But now they have a new topic on the agenda where they wnat to have a delayed deadline by TWO or THREE months!!!

Seems like they are in big trouble.

There are rumors that Jean Todt and Renault president Carlos Ghosn met already to discuss this topic.
BUT. only one Veto by another team in the strategy group (Red Bull, Mercedes, Ferrari, McLaren, Lotus, Williams) will stop the delay.

So this will be very interesting.
source: http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 63169.html

[Crabbia]

i think the only way to accomplish this fairly is to move the homologation date back for everyone.
This means that mercedes and ferrari will still be able to develop but it will get them on board and have a better chance of the proposal not being vetoed.

it will be very interesting indeed...

[iotar__]

BREAKING NEWS from AMuS about Renault engines..

short version translated:

The deadline for engine suppliers when they have to give the engine to the FIA for Homologation is tonight.

Renault told at the weekend that they have sorted out the biggest problems. But now they have a new topic on the agenda where they wnat to have a delayed deadline by TWO or THREE months!!!

Seems like they are in big trouble.

There are rumors that Jean Todt and Renault president Carlos Ghosn met already to discuss this topic.
BUT. only one Veto by another team in the strategy group (Red Bull, Mercedes, Ferrari, McLaren, Lotus, Williams) will stop the delay.

So this will be very interesting.
source: http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 63169.html

It's the same "trouble" and it has always been big even at best case scenario. Not big enough for constant internet drama hence 6 months/slapping Mercedes engine typo of noise and up and down emotions ("they're done"! - "they solved it"!).

I'd say it's about time/technicalities - actual freeze and freedom to work on it without applying for changes every time they need them. I think they'll get something out of it but not at the first attempt and unconditionally.

[jagunx51]

BREAKING NEWS from AMuS about Renault engines..

short version translated:

The deadline for engine suppliers when they have to give the engine to the FIA for Homologation is tonight.

Renault told at the weekend that they have sorted out the biggest problems. But now they have a new topic on the agenda where they wnat to have a delayed deadline by TWO or THREE months!!!

Seems like they are in big trouble.

There are rumors that Jean Todt and Renault president Carlos Ghosn met already to discuss this topic.
BUT. only one Veto by another team in the strategy group (Red Bull, Mercedes, Ferrari, McLaren, Lotus, Williams) will stop the delay.

So this will be very interesting.
source: http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 63169.html

just dreaming ....

[SiLo]

I can see why Mercedes teams would want to veto this decision, they have the upper hand. But then I can also see why they would accept and extension for EVERYONE because they can improve on their already superior design.

Swings and roundabouts, but I would love to see them veto it (if possible) because drama is always fun!

[Holm86]

I can see why Mercedes teams would want to veto this decision, they have the upper hand. But then I can also see why they would accept and extension for EVERYONE because they can improve on their already superior design.

Swings and roundabouts, but I would love to see them veto it (if possible) because drama is always fun!

Exactly. Mercedes and Ferrari would get more time to refine their own units. And seriously what is competetion without competitors?? I hope no one will veto this.

[Blackout]

I can see why Mercedes teams would want to veto this decision, they have the upper hand. But then I can also see why they would accept and extension for EVERYONE because they can improve on their already superior design.

Swings and roundabouts, but I would love to see them veto it (if possible) because drama is always fun!

Superior design ? we dont know yet...

[acosmichippo]

I can see why Mercedes teams would want to veto this decision, they have the upper hand. But then I can also see why they would accept and extension for EVERYONE because they can improve on their already superior design.

Swings and roundabouts, but I would love to see them veto it (if possible) because drama is always fun!

Exactly. Mercedes and Ferrari would get more time to refine their own units. And seriously what is competetion without competitors?? I hope no one will veto this.

The issue is room for improvement. If Mercedes or Ferrari think a couple months will only buy them a marginal increas in performance, but Renault can improve a ton, why would they allow it?