"Spoiler cars???"

[PlatinumZealot]

Was reading F1 fanantic and I found a quote from Adrian Newey:

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2014/03/11/w ... 014-newey/

But Newey added the performance of the 2011 car with exhaust-blowing didn’t quite reach that of the 2010 car when double diffusers were legal:

“The RB6 was probably the car with the most downforce in the history of F1, more even than the legendary spoiler cars of the 1980s. We measured up to 5.5G of lateral acceleration.

“It could go flat out through Copse at Silverstone, and on the sharp bend on the back straight at Barcelona [Campsa].”

Now, I didn't watch F1 in the eighties, so someone give me some background on what Adrain is talking about when he says "spoiler cars" what mechanism is he referring to? And did these cars really have that much down force?

[Sebp]

He's talking about ground effect cars. The "sidepods" if you want to call them that were in effect two big spoilers running alongside the car.

[Sebp]

[turbof1]

http://www.angelfire.com/ca/monzagt/

Basicilly, it refers to the ground effect case. Colin Chapman supposedly studied the aerodynamics of a fighter bomber, turned those effects litterally upside down (lift to downforce), and shaped the sidepods too in such a manner the car would be sucked down to the ground. Effectively the whole car was shaped as one big wing.

[Jolle]

I think there will always be one car that stands above all others with the amout of avalible downforce: the Brabham BT46 fan car. That car could generate so much downforce that the driver would pass out from G-lock.

[xxChrisxx]

I think there will always be one car that stands above all others with the amout of avalible downforce: the Brabham BT46 fan car. That car could generate so much downforce that the driver would pass out from G-lock.

Yeah, if it went to top speed it had enough downforce to push itsself into the Earths core. Along with the BMW turbo engine that had so much power it tore a hole in the spacetime continuum and caused Piquet to win the race before it had even started.

Provide evidence or I call needless hyperbole. Loss of consciousness is caused by longditudinal g, pulling the blood away from the brain. Never heard of anyone blacking out due to lateral g.

Edit. I should clarify. Longditudinal in this case means the axis going from head to foot.

[ecapox]

Indy car drivers almost passed out at Texas motor speedway due to the excessive Gs they were pulling in the corners....so it HAS happened.

CART cars.
http://onlineathens.com/stories/043001/ ... 0019.shtml

[xxChrisxx]

Banked tracks means the g force has a longditudinal component. Its also important to make the distinction between dizzyness and g induced black outs.

Im also not blindly dismissing the possibility it could happen. Its just that I seem to remember that humans can tolerate lateral g far better than longditudinal g.

[strad]

It was the fact that the banking was so steep that the blood was pulled down away from the brain. It was not just lateral Gs. And,,I don't believe for a second that the Brabham fan car made anyone pass out.

[matt21]

Now, I didn't watch F1 in the eighties, so someone give me some background on what Adrain is talking about when he says "spoiler cars" what mechanism is he referring to? And did these cars really have that much down force?

After the ban of ground effect, F1 was reverting to big wings. MAybe he is talking about something like this.

[MadMatt]

Banked tracks means the g force has a longditudinal component. Its also important to make the distinction between dizzyness and g induced black outs.

Im also not blindly dismissing the possibility it could happen. Its just that I seem to remember that humans can tolerate lateral g far better than longditudinal g.

Wrong. Where on earth do you have a longitudinal component when driving at constant speed on a banking? You are talking about VERTICAL component. Sorry but sometimes I get tired of reading sh** on a forum such as F1 technical.

[turbof1]

Banked tracks means the g force has a longditudinal component. Its also important to make the distinction between dizzyness and g induced black outs.

Im also not blindly dismissing the possibility it could happen. Its just that I seem to remember that humans can tolerate lateral g far better than longditudinal g.

Wrong. Where on earth do you have a longitudinal component when driving at constant speed on a banking? You are talking about VERTICAL component. Sorry but sometimes I get tired of reading sh** on a forum such as F1 technical.

I think it is compared to other things. Example perhaps could be a space shuttle taking off?

[PlatinumZealot]

Indy car drivers almost passed out at Texas motor speedway due to the excessive Gs they were pulling in the corners....so it HAS happened.

CART cars.
http://onlineathens.com/stories/043001/ ... 0019.shtml

Interesting. With the banked tracks though, the G-forces, in relation to the car's coordinate system is both lateral and vertical and they are not solely due to aero-dynamic down-force but the incline of the banking and speed of the car. So I could see why drivers were blacking out lol

On another note though, I wonder if Newey is also inculding the Fan car in the list of cars that the RB6 has more downforce than?

[xxChrisxx]

Banked tracks means the g force has a longditudinal component. Its also important to make the distinction between dizzyness and g induced black outs.

Im also not blindly dismissing the possibility it could happen. Its just that I seem to remember that humans can tolerate lateral g far better than longditudinal g.

Wrong. Where on earth do you have a longitudinal component when driving at constant speed on a banking? You are talking about VERTICAL component. Sorry but sometimes I get tired of reading sh** on a forum such as F1 technical.

I tried to clarify this in my earlier post, becuase I realised it was ambiguous.

Edit. I should clarify. Longditudinal in this case means the axis going from head to foot.

I didn't use vertical becuase that is being ambiguos w.r.t the banking or the ground, though it is less confusing that me calling it longditudinal. I suppose 'component prependicular to the banking'/'vertical axis of the body'.

Really should have been more careful with how I described it, sorry.

[Richard]

G-forces ...are not solely due to aero-dynamic down-force ...

Aero downforce does not create g-force. One is an externally applied load (N), the other is an acceleration (m/s2) due to change of velocity.