Mercedes AMG F1 W05

[diego.liv]

Motorsport-Magazin.com

http://www.motorsport-magazin.com/forme ... 63492.html

[Thunder]

Closer Look at the W05 Steering Wheel.

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 69313.html

[basti313]

Just because it's there doesn't mean that's the option they will go for.

Given the novelty of the rules it's better to be safe than sorry.

Running too much cooling can destroy your car, because some parts have a very narrow working range. So you would always go for the perfect cooling regarding the middle of the temperatures in the forecast.
What I think regarding these sidepods:

Any sign of the new nose?

All parts which are standing now in front of the garages are just parts which arrived directly from the test to serve as spare parts, because they don`t have enough parts of the new spec. They have nothing to copy for the contenders and are just in the way. It is the same with the TR front wings.
The first time we will see the new race spec will be tomorrow when they roll the new cars to the FIA check.

I'm pretty sure F1 engines has thermostats preventing the engine from running too cool. So I dont agree with your first statement.

Not the ICE is the problem. All parts around the ICE are the problem. For example batteries, MGU-K, exhaust...they all react in a very problematic way if they get too much cold air. Renault had the cold air problem during the tests resulting in broken exhausts.

[turbof1]

Hate to go further off topic but are you sincerely turning renaults/red bulls overheating issues into an undercooling one ?

[Holm86]

Not the ICE is the problem. All parts around the ICE are the problem. For example batteries, MGU-K, exhaust...they all react in a very problematic way if they get too much cold air. Renault had the cold air problem during the tests resulting in broken exhausts.

I still dont agree with you. You cant run the electronics around the engine too cool. Only downside with doing that is increased drag. So you make a compromise.

[basti313]

Hate to go further off topic but are you sincerely turning renaults/red bulls overheating issues into an undercooling one ?

Why are you misreading again?

[turbof1]

Hate to go further off topic but are you sincerely turning renaults/red bulls overheating issues into an undercooling one ?

Why are you misreading again?

*Renault/Lotus one, my bad.

Still, you can't expect to be taken serious when you say this:

Renault had the cold air problem during the tests resulting in broken exhausts

EDIT: I did made some effort to check around, and you have a point. Partly. It doesn't affect material, but the weldings can crack under cooler air. But that is more a mistake on lotus' part then on the cooler air. So the parts you described, batteries, mgu-k,... aren't going to malfunction. This is more an issue of first super heating the welds and then running suddenly cool air on it. the mgu-k, batteries, etc run on a very high temperature. You'd have to deepfreeze them in that state to get them starting to work less efficient.

The way I see it, the issue is still too much heat. Temperate on the welds in the exhaust at one point get very high, but during a cool down period, temperature drops so fast poorly welded places crack. If you run it cooler on a constant rate you are not having that issue.

[PlatinumZealot]

Source:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96cHD7H1ZEw

Interesting detail in this Render:

http://i.imgur.com/IKsQUP5.png

Seems they have an asymmetric Fuel-Tank?

Why would they do that?

I am more interesting in what goes into the large gap behind the fuel tank!

[RicerDude]

Motorsport-Magazin.com

http://www.motorsport-magazin.com/forme ... 63492.html

Side pod outlets look re-profiled maybe slightly smaller?

[PlatinumZealot]

Closer Look at the W05 Steering Wheel.

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 69313.html

Looked like Lewis carried over his "cut-off" style from his Mclaren. some years ago He influenced Mclaren to cut off the bottom of the steering wheel so that he can get the wheel to his liking. It seemed Merc development was too far ahead to make this change last year with the W04.

[basti313]

Not the ICE is the problem. All parts around the ICE are the problem. For example batteries, MGU-K, exhaust...they all react in a very problematic way if they get too much cold air. Renault had the cold air problem during the tests resulting in broken exhausts.

I still dont agree with you. You cant run the electronics around the engine too cool. Only downside with doing that is increased drag. So you make a compromise.

Niki Lauda was talking about the very narrow temperature window in January. As all systems are cooled by basically 3 circuits, engine water colling, engine oil cooling and gearbox oil cooling it is hard to say which item is affected when one of them is dropping out of its temperature window.
For me it is clear, that the do not have a temperature window of more than 20°C. Running a 30°C solution on a 20°C day means you are likely to drop out...which means more wear. And wear is something you want to avoid in a time when you are just experiencing how long the parts may work.
And in F1 you normally do not use a thermostat, especially not for oil cooling. A thermostat would add a flow restriction that you do not want.
You can find telemetry data in this forum with engine temps. You will see that they change up to 5°C during one lap.

And the different cooling solutions more affect the downforce than the drag. Drag should be mostly given by the size of the inlets and not by the outlets which change with the cooling solutions. The outlets disturb the airflow and reduce the downforce.

EDIT: I did made some effort to check around, and you have a point. Partly. It doesn't affect material, but the weldings can crack under cooler air. But that is more a mistake on lotus' part then on the cooler air.

Just a simple example that came to my mind.

So the parts you described, batteries, mgu-k,... aren't going to malfunction. This is more an issue of first super heating the welds and then running suddenly cool air on it. the mgu-k, batteries, etc run on a very high temperature. You'd have to deepfreeze them in that state to get them starting to work less efficient.

They are not going to malfunction, but they will have more wear. And "very high temperature" is not really high, water cooling is restricted to 130°C and oil cooling is round 100°C...
As BMW destroyed some engines by starting them at 80°C, I strongly doubt that modern gearboxes, MGU-Ks or engines like it to run at temperatures only 20°C below their working range...bearings and clearances are just too tight.

So I could understand Renault going for 10% more cooling with the danger of additional wear during fuel saving periods for example, but I strongly doubt Mercedes to go for more cooling as they should know how much cooling they really need and the fact, that too much wear in the first race could compromise the whole season.

[turbof1]

Well first of all my apologies for mocking you a bit earlier. You are making a lot more sence now.

Second, I can follow you in that too much cooling can get more friction. Engine pistons for example need to be on the correct heat due very very low tolerances.

However, 10% more cooling isn't the same as 10% less heat. Heat will still build up very high. Infact it's safe to assume these cars are running close to critical temperatures. I believe we are that part of the curve that gives more overall reliability in the long run by running more cooling.

It's like you say: you have 20 degrees celcius window. So you have an allowed deviation of -10,+10 degrees. Running a high cooling package on cooler track isn't going to result in a temperature deviation out of that window.

[basti313]

Well first of all my apologies for mocking you a bit earlier. You are making a lot more sence now.

Second, I can follow you in that too much cooling can get more friction. Engine pistons for example need to be on the correct heat due very very low tolerances.

However, 10% more cooling isn't the same as 10% less heat. Heat will still build up very high. Infact it's safe to assume these cars are running close to critical temperatures. I believe we are that part of the curve that gives more overall reliability in the long run by running more cooling.

It's like you say: you have 20 degrees celcius window. So you have an allowed deviation of -10,+10 degrees. Running a high cooling package on cooler track isn't going to result in a temperature deviation out of that window.

What a nice discussion developing.
The problem this weekend will be the temperature drop on Sunday of maybe 10°. This will give 10% more cooling...so you will likely not run too much cooling on Saturday, because it can be much too much on Sunday.

Well, the main part of the post starting this was: They are just spare parts from Bahrain. I don't believe we are seeing the actual race spec. Only Sauber and McL (partially...) showed race spec parts.
Let's see if these side pods still are standing in the edge tomorrow.

[OO7]

If I recall correctly, Parc Ferme regulations do not prevent teams from altering the cooling solutions on their cars.

[dans79]

Since flow rate is as significant if not more so than the actual ambient air temperature. I would be surprised if teams don't have means of altering the flow of the air inside the car to help control heating/cooling. Even taping over a radiator section like they do break ducts would have a significant impact, though would probably not be the cleanest solution.