Mclaren Mercedes 2014

[CjC]

You people act like Autosport is a poor source. Also, based on Honda's last f1 engine and current lack of turbo experience(not to mention the fact that Mclaren seems to have forgotten how to build an f1 car), I never understood why people think they'll come in and dominate. I don't know that its even technologically possible at the moment to go much better than the Merc engine without a government backed budget.

Edit: I guess this is some knock off and not the "real" Autosport.

Not to jump on your back, but honda make a v6 turbo for the Indy car series, albeit a 2.2L.

I think honda will make a really good combustion engine but I think they'll be all over the hybrid aspect and aim to have the best ERS technology in F1.

We can't really comment till we see a honda in the back of a mclaren, sure we it won't be the best engine or chassis next season but just look at the development curve Mercedes have risen on since 2010, it takes time.

Edit: just seen this:
http://www.formula1.com/news/interviews ... 15927.html

Eric talks about 'time' and refers to Mercedes plan.
He also mentions a major upgrade for Silverstone- ay right grand!!!!

[mclaren_mircea]

Ferrari had updates, Red Bull had updates, Williams had updates, but almost nothing on the Mclaren. I don't get that excuse with the Silverstone package. Ferrari and Red Bull will have updates too in Silverstone, they will not sit and wait for Mclaren. Why I can't see different engine covers, wings, floor on the Mclaren like on the other top cars. Only small tweaks on thr FW. Where are the smaller side pods. I understand that they received the package from Mercedes only in Juanuary, but a team like Mclaren should have had the sidepods from at leat Barcelona. Even in Austria will be nothing on the car, while the other are throwing updates in Canada, Austria and England. We are waiting only for England. How is that possible to work so slowly. I would have understood if the other wouldn't have had updates in Silverstone if they put them on the car in Canada, but they will have, and Mclaren is waiting only for Silverstone. I can't eat the excuse with the characteristics of the track. If Ferrari and Red Bull had so many updates on the car for Canada (aerodynamic updates not engien software) why Mclaren can't? What happened with this team in 2012? Something has broken gradually under Whitmarsh. Let's face it true. He did not designed the cars, but all the processes that went in the organisation are his responsability. The strategy, the recruitment, what people are leaving the company, what drivers you have in your cars, the determination, everything was under Whitmarsh's guidance. I think that Mclaren entered gradually in a smooth decline since he took over at Mclaren, and we touched the bottom in 2013. It will take years for Boullier to rebuild the organisation and for Ron to restore the authority and the resources in the right direction. I will never forgive his obsession to prove to the Mclaren Group board that Button is in the same category with Hamilton. In 2012 he wasted a lot of resources to make the car for Button's preference.

[KingHamilton01]

Ferrari had updates, Red Bull had updates, Williams had updates, but almost nothing on the Mclaren. I don't get that excuse with the Silverstone package. Ferrari and Red Bull will have updates too in Silverstone, they will not sit and wait for Mclaren. Why I can't see different engine covers, wings, floor on the Mclaren like on the other top cars. Only small tweaks on thr FW. Where are the smaller side pods. I understand that they received the package from Mercedes only in Juanuary, but a team like Mclaren should have had the sidepods from at leat Barcelona. Even in Austria will be nothing on the car, while the other are throwing updates in Canada, Austria and England. We are waiting only for England. How is that possible to work so slowly. I would have understood if the other wouldn't have had updates in Silverstone if they put them on the car in Canada, but they will have, and Mclaren is waiting only for Silverstone. I can't eat the excuse with the characteristics of the track. If Ferrari and Red Bull had so many updates on the car for Canada (aerodynamic updates not engien software) why Mclaren can't? What happened with this team in 2012? Something has broken gradually under Whitmarsh. Let's face it true. He did not designed the cars, but all the processes that went in the organisation are his responsability. The strategy, the recruitment, what people are leaving the company, what drivers you have in your cars, the determination, everything was under Whitmarsh's guidance. I think that Mclaren entered gradually in a smooth decline since he took over at Mclaren, and we touched the bottom in 2013. It will take years for Boullier to rebuild the organisation and for Ron to restore the authority and the resources in the right direction. I will never forgive his obsession to prove to the Mclaren Group board that Button is in the same category with Hamilton. In 2012 he wasted a lot of resources to make the car for Button's preference.

McLaren have already stated that they need to get it right and have moved to restructure the team and put people in the right place, it takes time to design and manufacture these part's it is a complex proccess and McLaren have asked us to wait until silverstone to judge them and there pace. Yes it is massively frustrating, but maybe McLaren will produce the good's come silverstone and bring the new nose/front wing, New sidepod's and new rear wing. if we get to silverstone and they don't bring anything noteable then we can bring this up and question what McLaren are doing. Until then we have to sit tight and see what the driver's can do in damage limitation mode.

[basti313]

I think honda will make a really good combustion engine but I think they'll be all over the hybrid aspect and aim to have the best ERS technology in F1.

We can't really comment till we see a honda in the back of a mclaren, sure we it won't be the best engine or chassis next season but just look at the development curve Mercedes have risen on since 2010, it takes time.

Well, I also think that Honda will build a good combustion engine. But we have already three teams pursuing the aim to build the best ERS tech in F1. They have now one year track experience with six or eight cars running...Honda wants to gain on them with two cars running...I do not think they will ever be as good as for example Merc with the PU. Hopefully they will at least be competitive in one or two seasons and will supply other teams.

The comparison with Merc is not really good. Merc was a WC winner and just did not manage to get the EBD working as good as the Renault powered cars. And they sacrificed two seasons for their FRIC system.

Why I can't see different engine covers, wings, floor on the Mclaren like on the other top cars.
......
What happened with this team in 2012? Something has broken gradually under Whitmarsh.

The aero is just not the problem. I stated this out after the second race and no one wanted to believe it. Now we are at number seven and still the same...always when they have to go over curbs or need to keep the car stable in fast corners they have problems. It is the suspension which has changed for 2013...

[F1 addicted]

Button drove the race of his life. He was awesome. Magnussen was avarage

[Felipe 92]

Button drove the race of his life. He was awesome. Magnussen was avarage

Race of his life was Canada 2011, today he was lucky to get 4th. If there wasn`t collision he would be 6th.

[F1 addicted]

Button drove the race of his life. He was awesome. Magnussen was avarage

Race of his life was Canada 2011, today he was lucky to get 4th. If there wasn`t collision he would be 6th.

Still. He was 14th on lap 45 and 20 sec behind Hulkenberg

[johnsonwax]

Race of his life was Canada 2011, today he was lucky to get 4th. If there wasn`t collision he would be 6th.

++. 2011 was the greatest drive I've ever seen in 15 years watching. 3 collisions, 2 extra runs through the pits, last place midway through the race, and comes on to win. I don't ever expect to see such a thing again in my life.

[Waffle]

Usually where there is smoke there is a fire!

Mclaren is own by three groups and one is very ill and the other been stating they were not happy with leadership(that was fixed with Dennis back at the wheel) and their return on investment(Mclaren Automotive was in the red until the P1 but what happens next year with the P1 gone).

Without Honda's money this year,Mclaren would be hurting!

The Japanese doesn't give money freely unless their getting something in return!

1)Looks like they got Mclaren to go to Le Mans.
2)Working on future production cars(becoming Honda's Tier 1 performance branch) but Honda would want equity.

So money always comes with a cost!

There have been plenty of occasions when engine manufacturers have had works deals with teams without having any ownership or "getting something in return" as you put it. Williams, for instance, had such deals with Honda and Renault. The reason they do it is marketing - if they're successful, they hope to sell more cars.

As for McLaren Automotive only making a profit because of the P1 - do you have the slightest evidence of this?

They're a new startup business. It's the nature of new businesses that they make a loss at first. That's why they were making a loss, and now they're making a profit. They continue to expand into new markets and new product lines.

Finally, McLaren at Le Mans will be a GT car, and therefore almost certainly powered by a McLaren engine. That's got nothing to do with Honda. If you think it does, again could you provide some evidence?

You do realise that Honda have already denied any intention to buy into McLaren, don't you?

Where's there smoke, there's a desperate journalist making up a story.

1)Their a private own company so they do not post finacials but it is the reason the Bahrain ruling family wants to sell their 50% share.

2)In my private insider motorsport FB group a Wirth engineer was pissed that Honda pulled the P1 program from them!
It has been a program at Woking since last year.

3)Honda has never made a statement about the story!Only Mclaren.

A little hint wants going on....Bahrain isn't happy with Mclaren at the moment(looking to sell) and RD is trying to find funds to buy all or some of their shares so he will have majority(control) of the company.He will do almost anything to keep Bahrain from selling the majority share to a stranger even if it means Honda buys it.I think the plan is RD buys half(25%) and Honda buys half(25%) and RD get some of his long time partner's share at a discount(1%)so he would always be the majority owner(51%).

You're right about Honda - my mistake. They haven't made any statement.

Forgive me if you have insider information. My scepticism is entirely based on information in the public domain. None of what you say is public apart from Dennis's desire to up his stake. I'll maintain my scepticism for now, if you don't mind. It's my default position when not presented with any evidence.

It's worth noting that McLaren has a different ownership structure to McLaren Group. Wanting to sell one stake doesn't necessarily imply wanting to sell the other. Not unlikely though.

[CjC]

Seems to have been resolved.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114371

A few members in here suggested the likely outcome.

[Sasha]

More was talked about than a aero guy.

RB is looking for a new PU!

[Thunder]

More was talked about than a aero guy.

RB is looking for a new PU!

Although this is the McLaren Thread so this is the wrong Place for that, RB has comfirmed Remault for 2015.
http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/form ... 97546.html

[Sasha]

RB only signed for one year(2015).Honda PU not a option until 2016.

[Thunder]

You're free to bring that Topic up over at the Red Bull Thread.

[enkidu1978]

Notice how the last two races Button has come alive after the first and some way into the second stint??? I’m wondering if they got two problems, one they not warming up tyres over one lap in qually and the other that trick suspension working better lighter fuel loads?