FRIC Could Be Banned As Soon As Germany

[basti313]

Using the FIA's logic (which deem interconnected suspensions as an aerodynamic aid) then 3rd springs would also be illegal since they only exist to control the pitch angle and ride height coming from aerodynamic downforce. This is why you don't see them on non aero cars.

Yes, but this is complicated. Just saying "you are not allowed to connect your suspension with fluids, gases or mechanics except a torsion bar" would be easy and clear. And it would save a lot of money.

Yes correct that will indeed work but that isn't the current argument. The critical discussion now is whether or not interconnected suspensions are illegal with respect to the CURRENT rules.

Ok, you are right. I have a rule change in mind, which should have occurred a long time ago.

Regarding the 3rd spring: The rule of movable aero excludes the sprung part of the car. I would say a third spring is part of the sprung part, so this should no problem in contrast to hydraulic cylinders driving the interconnected suspension.

[dren]

Have you guys seen this? - http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/114881

Can't see a separate place to discuss it, what are your thoughts on the impact it might have?

I posted in the general section. It's utter BS, but at the same time, several teams run a FRIC system in some shape or form. Somebody is putting pressure on Charlie to ban the system, and the only place I can look is Ferrari. I don't know any other team that has that much influence, plus Ferrari is one team I haven't heard of that runs it. Or maybe Mclaren?

What is this crapola about trying to blame Ferrari? I told you in the other thread Ferrari has run interconnected suspension since 2011.

I didn't see that, and now all of the posts are gathered in here. Only reason why I suspected Ferrari is because they typically have the most influence. But if all teams are running some sort of similar suspension set-up, then it likely will stay until next year since it requires a unanimous vote to keep. The smaller teams will surely be pressured by their engine suppliers. Although we certainly have to look at who has the most to gain and who has the most to lose.

[Just_a_fan]

If the teams vote against the ban then it won't happen until 2015 next season. If it's just the poorer teams that don't have it then they'll probably be paid to support the status quo for the rest of the season. A little "technical support" from one of the big boys would be welcomed by any of the smaller teams.

The whole thing smacks of the FIA, on behalf of Bernie, trying to re-level the field for the rest of the season. I can't see RBR, Ferrari, Williams, Force India or McLaren asking for the ban as a way of slowing Mercedes - they'd potentially lose too much themselves when the middle of the constructors' table is so close. I could see Lotus doing it just as a way of trying to improve their position, however.

It smells of Bernie. Bernie BS.

[SectorOne]

Not against the ban in general, it's just a weird thing to do mid-season after it first has been allowed

This,

Ban it after the season, fine that´s the name of the game but removing the system on a car that has been built from the ground up with that in mind that´s not ok in my opinion.

Btw, does Mclaren run a FRIC system of sorts?
If not then my guess is that if all the teams would vote, they would be the only team not to go along.
They have no ties to anyone, they are not competitive and probably would not mind sticking it to Mercedes who is believed to have the best system.

[bill shoe]

Hmmm. My initial frustration at the FIA's illogical statement is wearing off. The illogic seems too obvious. Am I attributing bad technical interpretation to something that is actually a power/political move? "Reduce Merc dominance" also seems too simple and obvious.

The FIA throws a bucket of sh*t into the room and forces all the teams to agree on something rather arbitrary, or else most of the cars become illegal and have to get awkward band-aid changes by the next race.

Perhaps this is an attempt to force big teams to give money to small teams in return for unanimous agreement to allow FRIC thru the end of the season? RB has either written off the season or else they would be happy to try the joker of no FRIC. Same for all the other non-MB frontrunners. So it would seem that most or all of the payout money would logically come from Mercedes. The 3 or 4 backmarkers would insist on rather large payouts. I would think Caterham would value their agreement rather highly (as an example). So the net effect is that Mercedes has to write large checks to the 3 or 4 teams that are teetering on insolvency.

Maybe this is not a matter of Charlie Whiting reviewing technical drawings. Maybe this is a matter of Jean Todt reviewing financial statements... It does involve Mercedes, but the intention is not to change Mercedes dominance on the track.

[Just_a_fan]

Btw, does Mclaren run a FRIC system of sorts?
If not then my guess is that if all the teams would vote, they would be the only team not to go along.
They have no ties to anyone, they are not competitive and probably would not mind sticking it to Mercedes who is believed to have the best system.

Perhaps but they aren't great friends of the FIA either. And no one wants to be the team that's seen as needing the FIA to intervene in order to compete. That's not good PR. I can't see Ron Dennis wanting to be known as that sort of guy either.

They might, however, adapt the current car to run FRIC-free for the rest of the season and use it as a test bed for next year. Whether it would be financially viable is the question. The better you do this year, the more money you get next year - although the more it costs you to enter next year too. So the mid field teams, including McLaren, would be better off consolidating their positions to maximise points-income for next year.

[Tim.Wright]

Regarding the 3rd spring: The rule of movable aero excludes the sprung part of the car. I would say a third spring is part of the sprung part, so this should no problem in contrast to hydraulic cylinders driving the interconnected suspension.

Thats debatable. The third spring doesn't have a connection to the chassis. Its "floating" between the two rockers in exactly the same way that the hydraulic fluid is floating between the front and rear hydraulic clkinders

[SilverArrow10]

Can the teams that run FRIC actually change the car so that they wont have it in time for Germany. I can understand banning at the end of the season but not now.

[SectorOne]

They might, however, adapt the current car to run FRIC-free for the rest of the season and use it as a test bed for next year.

So they do run FRIC system on the Macca? My little idea there was based on if they do not have the system on the car, that could be a plausible thing to do.

[iotar__]

It doesn't matter who has it, it matters who extracts from it the most or who gains/loses from banning it. I'm glad that special F1 meeting called by Ferrari went well and mighty of this sport are focusing on important issues to make it better. Another questionable mid-season change and sudden realisation by Whiting? It smells. So how is jockey-body-type issue that limits already limited pool of talent of drivers working out?

[markn93]

In case you were wondering -

Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1 · 5m
@gizm770o FIF1 have it on and off. Everyone else runs it

Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1 · 2m
@thejudge13 @scarbs merc lotus ferr RBR marussia have been heavily tied into it for a while

[FrukostScones]

new Caterham bosses have good connections apparently...

BTW: expect ALO surge if they really ban it from Germany onwards....

[basti313]

Can the teams that run FRIC actually change the car so that they wont have it in time for Germany. I can understand banning at the end of the season but not now.

This will be a hard task. As they still use normal anti roll bars the roll stability will not be crucial...but they use it not only for roll stability...as the teams for example lift the nose at high speed with the FRIC system, the whole ride height has to be changed and, thus, the whole aero concept.

[SectorOne]

In case you were wondering -

Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1 · 5m
@gizm770o FIF1 have it on and off. Everyone else runs it

Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1 · 2m
@thejudge13 @scarbs merc lotus ferr RBR marussia have been heavily tied into it for a while

Great info!

Interesting, now with that i´m quite positive teams will all vote to postpone it.

[dans79]

Great info!

Interesting, now with that i´m quite positive teams will all vote to postpone it.

it should be postponed for safety reasons alone. I'm sure several cars aerodynamic stability is tied to the fric system being in place. We don't need another 94 Imola.