2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

[NathanOlder]

Yeah, So Nico drove into Lewis

[Waywardism]

Alongside doesnt mean, front wing inside rear wheel. Its got to be atleast Front Wheel next to rear wheel

The rules disagree with you:

For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion'.

I see the problem with your take on this incident.

1. The contact happened in the middle of the track (Rosberg had not been squeezed to the edge)
2. Rosberg moved right into Hamilton not the other way around

If the contact had taken place at the apex of the left hander then you could possibly have a point, but it didn't and you don't.

[mikeerfol]

20 seconds penalty for Magnussen. Fair.

[dans79]

Rosberg had a good 6 feet to his left! the door was not shut!

Agree with this....Rosberg had enough room to move further left to still make the corner and not impede Hamilton.
This is exactly why the Merc bosses are fuming.

I completely agree, its not very often you see the entire paddock damn someone so unanimously.

[ChrisM40]

Fact is, if there was room and lewis aggressively shut the door, then Nico wouldn't have a wing left at all, and probably not even a wheel.
Nico was right to hustle lewis there, what he did wrong was not feed in behind lewis correctly when it was obvious the move wasnt on. These moves have been tried hundreds of times before without contact and many times with causing it, the puncture was just bad luck.

[markn93]

Alongside doesnt mean, front wing inside rear wheel. Its got to be atleast Front Wheel next to rear wheel

The rules disagree with you:

For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion'.

Only with regard to the preceding straight, I believe, not the corner. A similar discussion was had in Bahrain I seem to remember.

[NTS]

Agree with this....Rosberg had enough room to move further left to still make the corner and not impede Hamilton.
This is exactly why the Merc bosses are fuming.

I think if he would have done that he would T-bone or run into the back of Hamilton at that left hander that was a few meter further. At least that is my experience in karting. And that's how Maldonado ran into Hamilton two years ago: Move over a bit, then realize that the exit line of that corner has now become impossible and run into the other guy.

The way to fix this was not for ROS to move over, but to brake or lift off the gas and slot in behind HAM. And for HAM to give him slightly more time to do that by leaving some space on the inside of that left hand corner. Both options would have fixed this and both would have ended with HAM in front. So this was really a silly incident (unacceptable is the right word by Toto) that both drivers should have avoided.

[ChrisM40]

Alongside doesnt mean, front wing inside rear wheel. Its got to be atleast Front Wheel next to rear wheel

The rules disagree with you:

For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion'.

I see the problem with your take on this incident.

1. The contact happened in the middle of the track (Rosberg had not been squeezed to the edge)
2. Rosberg moved right into Hamilton not the other way around

If the contact had taken place at the apex of the left hander then you could possibly have a point, but it didn't and you don't.

Bravo, thats exactly right.

[Jano11]

Did you read the rules and how being alongside is defined?
No? I didn't expect it either given your angry and not reasoned posts.
Now show me why stating the truth is a lie, or keep it for yourself next time. calling others liars needs proof or otherwise I might just ask my lawyer to send you a nice letter, he's getting his paycheck every month, might as well do some work for it.

Your application of the rule is faulty. Its basically impossible to have a fair race with your interpretation. He was never significantly alongside on the inside, only on the outside, you cant apply that rule there, and no one ever does.[/quote]

Why is that you can not have a race with the rules as they are?
We have been told for ages now that one has to leave enough room for any car that is alongside, alongside being defined as:

For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion'.

As long as one doesn't trip over the car alongside they can race as much as they want, given that the track is wider then needed by two cars, they just need to think while racing.

[ChrisM40]

Why is that you can not have a race with the rules as they are?
We have been told for ages now that one has to leave enough room for any car that is alongside, alongside being defined as:

For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion'.

As long as one doesn't trip over the car alongside they can race as much as they want, given that the track is wider then needed by two cars, they just need to think while racing.

You interpretation of the rules would mean that no driver would ever have to actually pass another, all they would have to do is get their nose past the rear wheels. Clearly thats silly and would make racing impossible.

Nico never got this nose up the inside of lewis, it was on the outside of the left hander, at which point he was going slower and had to feed back in behind, it was the feed in that he got wrong.

[Jano11]

When you enter les Combes you're done looking in the rear view mirror.

What you describe is irresponsible racing, especially when you know that there is another car alongside your rear wheel.
This time it was just a broken end plate and a flat tire, but what if the outcome is worse?

They often claim they didn't see a car coming alongside, in most cases they just use this as an excuse for a naughty move, cause when fighting for position they all check their mirrors, all the time. Best example being the Magnussen Alonso fight today where they were changing position all the time in order to block each other, can't do that without checking your mirrors.

[bauc]

20 seconds penalty for Magnussen. Fair.

Source? Thanks

[SectorOne]

Why is that you can not have a race with the rules as they are?

You are not reading the rule properly. That´s the whole issue here really.

Any driver defending his position on a straight, and before any braking area, may use the full width of the track during his first move, provided no significant portion of the car attempting to pass is alongside his. Whilst defending in this way the driver may not leave the track without justifiable reason.

He did comply with this rule to the fullest. On a straight and before any braking area, he may use all of the track provided no significant portion of the other car is alongside. Rosberg was alongside, Hamilton did not use the full width of the track on the straight and before the braking area.

[Jano11]

Why is that you can not have a race with the rules as they are?
We have been told for ages now that one has to leave enough room for any car that is alongside, alongside being defined as:

For the avoidance of doubt, if any part of the front wing of the car attempting to pass is alongside the rear wheel of the car in front this will be deemed to be a 'significant portion'.

As long as one doesn't trip over the car alongside they can race as much as they want, given that the track is wider then needed by two cars, they just need to think while racing.

You interpretation of the rules would mean that no driver would ever have to actually pass another, all they would have to do is get their nose past the rear wheels. Clearly thats silly and would make racing impossible.

It's been like this for several years now and racing was possible, and with a few exceptions all drivers managed to race fine while respecting each other and leaving enough space. There's been a few drivers repeatedly involved in close racing incidents, won't list them cause we all know them already.

[Jano11]

Why is that you can not have a race with the rules as they are?

You are not reading the rule properly. That´s the whole issue here really.

Any driver defending his position on a straight, and before any braking area, may use the full width of the track during his first move, provided no significant portion of the car attempting to pass is alongside his. Whilst defending in this way the driver may not leave the track without justifiable reason.

Thanks for proving my point. A significant part of Rosberg's car was alongside Hamilton (unless you consider a front wing insignificant), based on the letter of the rules.