2014 Belgian GP - Spa-Francorchamps

[Jano11]

Anyway, the issue here is that both have their share of blame in this incident, and both could have avoided it, that's why no one got a penalty and why this is called racing incident.

You are not going to get anyone here to admit HAM could have avoided it.

In karting we have a few guys in our team that tend to drive "elbows out", which is a style you choose. HAM does the same thing, he chooses to turn left there instead of leaving half a meter of extra space at the apex of the next corner. He has the right to do so, and it gets him an advantage if it works (which is 9 our of 10 times), but it ends in tears 1 out of 10 times. Similar thing: Previous race he let the car run so wide on the exit that ROS had to go on the grass, which allowed HAM to stay in front. Again: This is a style that he chooses, he fights to the limit and it is within the rules, but it does run the risk of more incidents.

I've also seen VET do this a lot lately, he pushes to the edge and sometimes it goes wrong. Counter-examples are BUT and until last year WEB, both would have left a space here, sometimes loose a position to a more agressive driver (WEB to VET a few times for example), but it does avoid DNFs which in the end also cost points.

It´s also not a racing incident when Maldonado on purpose hit Hamilton in SPA 2012(?)

Actually that's another perfect example. HAM let his car run wide (allowed by the rules), which forced MAL a bit off the track. But instead of MAL braking and loosing a spot to this agressive move (as would have been the right thing to do), he stayed in there and T-boned HAM. That's the risk that HAM takes with his driving style.

However, without this style HAM would not score as many points as he does. So it's a "good thing", we should just accept that he is involved in more DNFs than others and that is partially his own fault for being more agressive.

You are right, I came to the same conclusion. I tried though.

[ChrisM40]

Can't agree.
There are a bunch of drivers on the grid who would have easily avoided this because of their different mindset when racing hard.

Then they're not racing drivers.

I agree, they are called losers, who shouldn't be in F1, or any class of motorsport.

[SectorOne]

Actually that's another perfect example. HAM let his car run wide (allowed by the rules), which forced MAL a bit off the track. But instead of MAL braking and loosing a spot to this agressive move (as would have been the right thing to do), he stayed in there and T-boned HAM. That's the risk that HAM takes with his driving style.

However, without this style HAM would not score as many points as he does. So it's a "good thing", we should just accept that he is involved in more DNFs than others and that is partially his own fault for being more agressive.

That´s Valencia Einstein. I´m talking about SPA after Quali or the race, can´t remember exactly.

But Valencia is also 100% Maldonado´s fault, he´s off the circuit and shall enter with precaution, instead he just drives straight out. This is the stupidity of Maldonado.
Grosjean showed how to do it properly without crashing. Because he´s got more racecraft.

[Jano11]

Can't agree.
There are a bunch of drivers on the grid who would have easily avoided this because of their different mindset when racing hard.

+1, there is a difference in style. VET* would have done exactly the same thing as HAM and had an incident, while BUT would not have done that. And that's probably the point that ROS was trying to make... HAM has a mindset that causes accidents once in a while, which is a risk he seems willing to take. ROS got tired of it and let him have his accident.

(* -> And you could call me a Red Bull fan, so please don't take this as undue criticism on Vettel for not liking him)

This just reminded me that Hamilton also had a close encounter with Button last time around when he was overtaking without consideration and respect for his fellow racers. He got lucky then, and less lucky today. Maybe it's just karma.

[SectorOne]

It´s amazing how people even though Rosberg has created the incident on purpose, is still trying to put blame on Hamilton.

If you think you can luck into a WDC 4 or 7 times.

You sound like a prissy little german boy!

that may or may not have had another account starting with mmmm

[ChrisM40]

Anyway, the issue here is that both have their share of blame in this incident, and both could have avoided it, that's why no one got a penalty and why this is called racing incident.

You are not going to get anyone here to admit HAM could have avoided it.

In karting we have a few guys in our team that tend to drive "elbows out", which is a style you choose. HAM does the same thing, he chooses to turn left there instead of leaving half a meter of extra space at the apex of the next corner. He has the right to do so, and it gets him an advantage if it works (which is 9 our of 10 times), but it ends in tears 1 out of 10 times. Similar thing: Previous race he let the car run so wide on the exit that ROS had to go on the grass, which allowed HAM to stay in front. Again: This is a style that he chooses, he fights to the limit and it is within the rules, but it does run the risk of more incidents.

I've also seen VET do this a lot lately, he pushes to the edge and sometimes it goes wrong. Counter-examples are BUT and until last year WEB, both would have left a space here, sometimes loose a position to a more agressive driver (WEB to VET a few times for example), but it does avoid DNFs which in the end also cost points.

It´s also not a racing incident when Maldonado on purpose hit Hamilton in SPA 2012(?)

Actually that's another perfect example. HAM let his car run wide (allowed by the rules), which forced MAL a bit off the track. But instead of MAL braking and loosing a spot to this agressive move (as would have been the right thing to do), he stayed in there and T-boned HAM. That's the risk that HAM takes with his driving style.

However, without this style HAM would not score as many points as he does. So it's a "good thing", we should just accept that he is involved in more DNFs than others and that is partially his own fault for being more agressive.

You are right, I came to the same conclusion. I tried though.

Oh no, you dont get to back off like that, you claimed it was lewis fault, you cant back peddle now and claim you were right all along by changing what you meant. Nico should have known the outcome, end of story.

Trying to bring other unrelated events into this is disingenuous. Lewis did nothing wrong, nico did, thats all there is to it here.

[Jano11]

Can't agree.
There are a bunch of drivers on the grid who would have easily avoided this because of their different mindset when racing hard.

Then they're not racing drivers.

I agree, they are called losers, who shouldn't be in F1, or any class of motorsport.

Some of those losers, have more WDCs then Hamilton though. They might be losing it right.

[FoxHound]

I'd give Hamilton first call on strategy and allow him to switch strategy until the 18 points Rosberg gained is nullified.
Of course with less races to go, this will still benefit Rosberg. So perhaps keep it as Hamilton being de facto number 1 until the scores are level.

Then let them play fairly under the proviso that any untoward manoeuvre will result in some performance defecit to the opposing team "mate".

[Jano11]

Oh no, you dont get to back off like that, you claimed it was lewis fault, you cant back peddle now and claim you were right all along by changing what you meant. Nico should have known the outcome, end of story.

My point, check my posts, was that this is a racing incidents and I fully agreed with the stewards not taking any action.
Good try though.

[SilverArrow10]

Time to call the mods on this one me thinks. Everyone to the Hamilton VS Rosberg thread if its still open

[ChrisM40]

Some of those losers, have more WDCs then Hamilton though. They might be losing it right.

Im wondering who you mean because all the WDCs in that race would have done the same in that fairly standard situation and indeed do so regularly. It wasnt anything special, it was just a botched move by Nico, nothing more. What are you seeing that no one else, at all, is?

[Töm87]

I am sorry, but it's not like this was a Senna/Prost Schumacher Villeneuve type of incident. Rosberg simply made a littee istake. In most cases this woud have only hurt himself. Just bad luck that Hamilton got a mechinacal.
Anyway, disrespecting team order was a lot worse than what Niko did today. He just made a littlemisatke,not eve a big one. Hamilton acted on full pirpose. Hamiton Fanboys really need to put things into perspective.

[SectorOne]

The guy isn´t only dirty but he´s twofaced as well.

And Hamilton said Rosberg had even tried to blame him for the incident.

“He just came in there and said it was all my fault. Just came in there..."

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/207980/1/h ... mpaign=rss

Now i don´t even believe his little brain lapse in Monaco, i think it was 100% deliberate to secure pole.

[ChrisM40]

Oh no, you dont get to back off like that, you claimed it was lewis fault, you cant back peddle now and claim you were right all along by changing what you meant. Nico should have known the outcome, end of story.

My point, check my posts, was that this is a racing incidents and I fully agreed with the stewards not taking any action.
Good try though.

Racing incidents can still be someones fault, you know that right?

[iotar__]

So who agrees with telling like it is old school Niki Lauda (or maybe he changed his mind ) ?
- "You have to be a bastard if you just want to win [races] in Formula One, no question. You cannot win by being a nice guy. Tell me one nice guy up there. Are you going to say Fernando Alonso? No, it's a breed of people who are 110% focused and use every trick to blow the other one off."
- "Sebastian just said the thing he needs to do to be a world champion, and well. Now everyone knows exactly what it is." Lauda insisted Vettel's tattered relationship with Webber is not even a side-issue. "It doesn't matter," he said. "Sebastian made a clear statement, and I would do the same. And he has been supported by the fact that Red Bull has now said there will be no team orders (anymore)." Told, however, that harmony within a F1 team must be a crucial issue, Lauda persisted: "Who cares about peace? You have to win.[..]"
- "My strategy is very simple. So far, my drivers have not clashed in any way and I want that to go on until there is no third driver challenging for the title," "Then they can drive over each other if they want to - and whoever survives is the world champion. I want them to see everybody else off and then, when there is no other enemy, it is really going to be warfare."
Let's not pretend Ricciardo is in contention, he isn't plus team didn't care about him in Hungary letting him win (Wolff).