Rory Byrne vs Adrian Newey

[acela]

Rory Byrne vs Adrian Newey

[Steven]

what about it?
don't you have your own opinion first to share with us?

Considering aerodynamics, I would still rate Newey higher than Byrne.
I just happen to like the newey cars over and over again, while I think Byrne is more like a manager, one who knows well who is good at what in his team.

It are just two different qualities...

[acela]

how good is rory's designed car compared to newey's car? how come people always say newey's car is the best. i know that adrian is an aeronatical engineering graduate compare to rory byrne chemical engineering degree. but that doesn't mean adrian's car is the best. something must distinguish between these two best car designers. their opinion on such cases like the keel issues.

[hed]

newey's car killed ayrton senna.

[Irvingthien]

newey's car killed ayrton senna

It was Head's car that killed Senna.

Rory Byrne vs Adrian Newey

Good topic.There is a feature on itv-f1 about Newey and Byrne.So,this is the correct comparison instead of Brawn V Newey.
Newey is an aeronautical engineer and that puts a little better than Byrne since F1 cars today is all about aero.What makes Newey better is that he's one of the most sought after asset on the grid.ANd i think McLaren should do everything to hold on to him.

[Steven]

newey's car killed ayrton senna.

That's truly rubbish... it were the rules that permitted it.
You can argue he should not have driven over those bumps, or should have braked, or not have signed at Williams... etc. None of them had made any mistake, end of story

[Guest]

newey's car killed ayrton senna

It was Head's car that killed Senna.

I'd say it was just unbelievably bad luck that killed Senna.

As for Newey vs. Byrne... It'd be interesting to add a few more names here. Gascoyne/Brunner for example?

[Guest]

neway has a definitive flaw:he wants to have a place at the pitwall,but there he is not a match for Brawn.He did not excell as a race engeneer either asfar as I know.
His March and Leytonhouse designs were alittle bit extreme..to the extend that they worked only on one or two tracks...So one could say Williams /Head brought out his best controlling his adventurous tracks.
He knew what he did ,and could transfer his knowledge to Mac,no doubt.
If his latest designs are up to the current opposition...well I doubt that ,but so you don´t know how m uch he has to say anyway.In Reality he is not a managing designer ,he is a geniusand all that people guiding and paperworks and planning just gets on top of him .
Byrne is very seldom at the track and rightly so.He is the sort of guy with the ideas,he may not even be very cad proficient,but who cares?He knows what a good car needs and he is able to layout a car to Schumachers needs to perfection and his attention to detailis reminding to John Barnards work of artbut his designs deliver....
So it is Byne who does maximise on his potential,whereas Neway seems to struggle a bit with all his responsibilities today,and is wasting his talent a bit

[dumrick]

I think Byrne is far better. In terms of design, besides making the Ferrari wonders, he did some magnificent Benettons in the 80's-90's, despite the lack of means.

Newey is good, but goes too far in some designs (MP-18/19 and the Leyton Houses, that were only competitive in the Paul Ricard). He needs someone like Head to direct him.

[Guest]

this is becoming a my dad is stronger than your dad type of discussion.
In the past years byrne's cars has definitly been the best, but by the looks adrian's is by far the best looking cars on the grid

[guestAgain]

How you can compare these men without knowing anything about them is beyond me. Guest states:

neway has a definitive flaw:he wants to have a place at the pitwall,but there he is not a match for Brawn.He did not excell as a race engeneer either asfar as I know

Do you know Adrian personally or did he tell you he wants to have a place on the wall?
Another states "he went too far with 18/19". Well do we know if he infact designed them? Or how about, 'wosnames car killed Senna'?????? What was your point exactly, that
A) The design was flawed?
B) either man Killed senna...and by extention is not as good as wosname#2?
C) All of the above.
D) I dont really know what I am talking about but have to say something?
Are your arguments about facts, not losing argument/face, having something to say on the subject or just posturing (i.e I know more about F1/Personalities than everybody else). Please dont state opinions as if they were facts. if you know squat then stay out of the discussion. Grown men/women (especially those as techinically savvy as most people on this forum are) do not have a 'wosname A is better that wosname B' type of argument/discussion. It is a silly and pointless excercise. Even the fact that A's cars may be better than B's cars, says nothing about the abilities of each.

[dumrick]

Yeah, good point, but this hasn't too be a discussion THAT serious.

Personally, I'm a big fan of some of old Byrne's cars, like the Toleman TG183 (and the way he solved the weight balance issue with a front radiator and his second wing), the TG 185 (with the stepped floor and "ingenious" brake ducts), and the Benetton B189 (for me, the best-looking F1 car ever), so I'm biased in this discussion, for sure.

[dumrick]

Another states "he went too far with 18/19". Well do we know if he infact designed them?

Silly question . We all know that HE DIDN'T. A huge team did. He just happens to be the technical director...

[West]

I don't know how you can compare the two. They have different approaches to building a car. It doesn't matter what degrees they have; it all comes down to building a winning car. Newey did help design the MP4/17D and that car was great considering it was a two-year old design, and that it had the weakest engine of the top three.

As for the Ayrton Senna thing... grow up. Somebody died in a car accident in a Honda Civic; that means Honda makes TERRIBLE cars huh?

Why don't we compare Asiatech to Peugeot instead.

[GuestAgain]

Dumrick wrote:

Silly question. We all know that HE DIDN'T. A huge team did. He just happens to be the technical director...

There is speculation/rumour - call it what you will, that he didnt. That in fact after the 18, he was against pushing forward with the 19 but was over-ruled. Whatever the case, it is still speculation.
So here's another silly question for you. Speculation or not, tech director or not and huge team or not, do you for know for a fact that HE DIDNT?