Driving style and fuel use

[turbof1]

The shown numbers are also based on the race laps, but when the race starts the drivers will already have burned off an installation lap and a formation lap - at a much lower pace of course. Combine that with the fact they also still need to do an inlap and a fuel sample, and things get very complicated even if FOM has access to the actual fuel loads.

[dans79]

For the same reason they obviously don't want one driver using a different engine map than the other. There's heaps of evidence for this - the spat in Bahrain (where Rosberg apparently used a different engine map) and in a later race, when Hamilton repayed the favour (China?).

That's different though, using the wrong engine map is detrimental to the team and the driver, because the driver could burn up the motor. The only thing I can see potentially being negative about under fueling the car, is the chance of running out, everything else is a positive!

[mrluke]

Are you overcomplicating this?

Is it not as simple as the Fuel used in Kgs is simply how much fuel the cars have used since the start of the race?

They started out stating a % (presumably assuming everybody would use 100kg) but changed it within the first few races to read KGs instead.

The Mark Hughes analysis sounds sensible but difficult to know for sure.

[SectorOne]

Has the gap in fuel usage decreased somewhat between the two? These comments were made prior to the German GP.

““So there are times when Nico is ahead and I’m able to see those things. And there are times when I’m ahead and he’s able to see it. For example the fuel usage. After the last race they found out how I’m saving fuel and he’ll be aware of that now and maybe he’ll be a lot closer on fuel usage.”
http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2014/07/h ... this-year/

Delta was about 1kg in Monza throughout the race but that could be track specific.

And from the comment section of the same article,

According to Mark Hughes they put less fuel into Hamitons car. It varies from track to track depending on the usage – at Bahrain, for instance, Mr Hughes reckons Hamilton had as much as 8.75kg less fuel than Rosberg at the start of the race.

Sounds a bit on the high side if you ask me.

James Allen responded on it saying:

"My info is that we are talking one or two kilos max under the 100kg
Maybe more in Monaco, but not the other races"

[dans79]

I can remember seeing 2 or almost 2 at various points during races this year, but over 8 is ludicrous.

[Juzh]

It came to light ros had a car infront of him on his last lap, so he was faster in speed trap and s1. Whether the car infront let him past or not after that is not clear. im pretty sure they ran identical cars though.

Is that the lap shown on F1.com onboards?
Because he has a car ahead of him on that lap but it´s so far ahead of him i doubt it had much of a significance.

Hm, not sure. Probably that one. It was hamilton who said this tbh, that's why i was going with it. It does seem the car infront is way too ahead and rosberg just nailed that 1st chicane, giving him lots of time.

[PlatinumZealot]

I will not be surprised if Rosberg is told to save fuel in this race.

[condor]

It's probably me but the way it was described I imagined it like this: Hamilton can lift and coast at the end of the straight saving fuel like no one else, then (and this is important part) he's making up the lost time in corners which oversimplifying would mean to be on the throttle earlier than everybody else (how else?), this damn car needs fuel to run whether it's a corner or a straight . I imagined fast corners and Red Bull 10-13.

No you haven't understood it correctly. The car doesn't necessarily need fuel to run in a corner. It uses fuel under throttle application. There will be parts of the corner that throttle is used while others parts not. Obviously throttle will be used to accelerate out of the corner, and also to balance the car in the corner if it's required but brake can also be used to balance the car depending on the corner, the car setup the driving style etc. You are oversimplifying by assuming he would have to be on the throttle earlier to make up the lap time. He could in fact be simply carrying more speed into the corner, through the corner and hence having to apply less throttle on exit.

It most definitely is a case of driver talent. One can't just dissect driving into various parts and ignore a clearly positive part that is fuel saving maintaining lap time as not part of driving talent while including other parts as showcases of talent. If a driver can do something, either learned or inherently part of his natural style, then it is a talent by the very definition of the word. Jenson's "smooth" driving style that is easy on the tyres was always lauded as a talent. Which it is.

Hamilton's ability to save fuel over Rosberg is not insignificant either. It's in the order of 2 to 3 percent over a typical race distance. This is a significant amount in a sport which is a game of tenths. It's not just an advantage for him this season, it would be for any season as it means he can carry less fuel and therefore less weight. Imagine if we still had one of the previous season's regulations where cars had to qualify on race fuel load. Hamilton would have a small but consistent advantage not just in the race, but also in qualifying where he can carry 2 to 3 kg less fuel than Rosberg.

[siskue2005]

I will not be surprised if Rosberg is told to save fuel in this race.

They can't say that anymore

[mikeerfol]

I will not be surprised if Rosberg is told to save fuel in this race.

They can't say that anymore

They can if it's for reliability reasons

[siskue2005]

What reliability problem can be justify a save fuel comment??
Anyways here is what the fia says

Message types not allowed
- Sector time detail of a competitor and where a competitor is faster or slower.
- Adjustment of power unit settings.
- Adjustment of power unit setting to de-rate the systems.
- Adjustment of gearbox settings.
- Learning of gears of the gearbox (will only be enforced from the Japanese Grand Prix onwards).
- Balancing the SOC [state-of-charge of batteries] or adjusting for performance.
- Information on fuel flow settings (except if requested to do so by race control).
- Information on level of fuel saving needed.
- Information on tyre pressures or temperatures (will only be enforced from the Japanese Grand Prix onwards).
- Information on differential settings.
- Start maps related to clutch position, for race start and pit stops.
- Information on clutch maps or settings, e.g. bite point.
- Burn-outs prior to race starts.
- Information on brake balance or BBW (brake-by-wire) settings.
- Warning on brake wear or temperatures (will only be enforced from the Japanese Grand Prix onwards).
- Selection of driver default settings (other than in the case of a clearly identified problem with the car).
- Answering a direct question from a driver, e.g. "Am I using the right torque map"?
- Any message that appears to be coded

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/ ... 16349.html

[andylaurence]

What reliability problem can be justify a save fuel comment??

You can be reasonably assured that when the car runs out of fuel, it will cease to run. You wouldn't rely on it to finish without any fuel, thus it is less reliable.

[Richard]

That FIA ref is out of date, the FIA allowed messages about the car systems. Have a look at the other thread http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewto ... 35#p533035

[dougskullery]

From what I understand, two traits of Hamilton's driving style are his ability to carry momentum through a corner, and his ability to manage a loose rear end (both mentioned in Mark Hughes' excellent Italian GP report).

More momentum through a corner means less fuel burned accelerating out. Loose rear end means more rear braking, more energy harvesting and greater support from ERS – which also means less fuel burned.

There are also some less 'direct' explanations. If you accept that Hamilton has a natural pace advantage, then that means he can afford to do more braking-and-coasting than Rosberg for the same overall laptime. But 'absolute pace' is one of those things that can never really be defined, so probably best to avoid those explanations.

[xpensive]

I will not be surprised if Rosberg is told to save fuel in this race.

They can't say that anymore

They can if it's for reliability reasons

Ah, "reliability reasons", you can do a lot of things with that xcuse.

How fake Formula 1 has become.