Do all teams use water cooled intercoolers now?

[Blackout]

They look too thin to me... like radiators... no intercooler there IMO.
In the left hand sidepod, you can see a large itercooler and the intake manifold pipe... IMO Williams, like Force India has (had?) a single air-air intercooler in the left hand sidepod.



But take a look at this:
http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/ ... /1197.html


Force India

[Brian Coat]

I dug out the article where I saw this Mercedes (only) dual cooler stuff.

Regarding temperatures, Ian Bamsey (Editor) states/estimates/speculates in RET that with a compressor outlet temperature of 200 deg. C, a water-air intercooler could get the temperature down to say 160 deg. C (assuming 120 deg. C coolant), leaving the remaining temperature drop (down to say 50 deg. C) to be handled by the air-air cooler.

I'm not saying Ian's right but I thought these were interesting remarks.

[gruntguru]

Regarding temperatures, Ian Bamsey (Editor) states/estimates/speculates in RET that with a compressor outlet temperature of 200 deg. C

I wonder where he got that number (200*C)? With 80% compressor efficiency that would equate to about 3.3 bar MAP. Perhaps he just took Renault's figure of 3.5 at face value.

[FW17]

What are the regulations on the working fluid for a intercooler? Does it specify it as water or it is open to exotic research and development?

[PlatinumZealot]

Only water allowed.

Water has one of the highest heat capacities of any liquid by far... so it is a good choice.

[wuzak]

Only water allowed.

Water has one of the highest heat capacities of any liquid by far... so it is a good choice.

Is that true?

I thought that the restriction was that they couldn't use the heat of vaporisation for cooling (as in refrigerators).

[PlatinumZealot]

Only water allowed.

Water has one of the highest heat capacities of any liquid by far... so it is a good choice.

Is that true?

I thought that the restriction was that they couldn't use the heat of vaporisation for cooling (as in refrigerators).

I will have to check. But water is the best thing you can use if you are talking about keeping the weight down and keeping things non-toxic and non-hazardous.

[gambler]

Say if the coolant (water) was 200F in the intercooler, would that mean the incoming air charge would be not chilled below 200. Where air to air may reach a lower temp if desired?

[PlatinumZealot]

The water would be much colder than that after passing through the radiator. You could touch it. It would be no higher than 45C to 50C I would suspect.

The air to water inter-cooler is piped to counter flow the two fluids running across them.

That means:

The hot air from the compressor going into the inter-cooler exchanges heat with the heated water going out of the inter-cooler to the radiator.

The cold water from the radiator going into the inter-cooler exchanges heat with the cooled air going out of the inter-cooler to the engine.

The radiator that cools the water is "Cross flow" Flow is at 90 degrees. there is a uniform cooling temperature for one fluid:
The heated water going into the radiator exchanges heat with the ambient air stream flowing across of the radiator fins.

[riff_raff]

Say if the coolant (water) was 200F in the intercooler, would that mean the incoming air charge would be not chilled below 200. Where air to air may reach a lower temp if desired?

With a liquid/air heat exchanger where the liquid coolant flowing into the core is 200degF, there is no way the intake airflow exiting the core will get anywhere close to 200degF. Since there should be a fairly large temp delta between the incoming liquid coolant and the airflow, the liquid coolant will increase in temperature while the airflow drops in temperature as they pass across the core. With an incoming liquid coolant at 200degF, the intake charge air temp would likely never get below 250degF or so.

[gruntguru]

The water would be much colder than that after passing through the radiator. You could touch it. It would be no higher than 45C to 50C I would suspect.

Automotive radiators usually run quite high coolant flow rates, so the outlet temperature is not that much lower than the inlet temperature. This is to minimise radiator size - the hotter the radiator, the greater the heat rejection.

[hollus]

This has already been posted elsewhere, but confirmed for Lotus, they had water cooled last year, air to air this year:
“We’ve gone back to air to air charge air cooling because the packaging switch to Mercedes power on a short timeline meant we had to find a simple solution.”
From http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2015/03/04/l ... t-testing/

[PlatinumZealot]

The water would be much colder than that after passing through the radiator. You could touch it. It would be no higher than 45C to 50C I would suspect.

Automotive radiators usually run quite high coolant flow rates, so the outlet temperature is not that much lower than the inlet temperature. This is to minimise radiator size - the hotter the radiator, the greater the heat rejection.

I think you find the temperatures are quite different across the radiator or intercooling. And remember the radiator for engine coolant is different. The flow actually is stopped by the thermostat and only activates when needed. Even still you can still touch the bottom pipe of a coolant radiator. The engine also lives at a high temperature so the thermostat only lets in some of the cold coolant at a time. This is not what you want for charge air cooling you want the charge air as cold as possible.

[gruntguru]

Agree with most of your post, however I don't recommend you touch the bottom tank of a radiator when the engine is at full load. I have measured these temperatures and can assure you that there can be as little as 5*C difference when the thermostat is open and the engine is revving hard.

[PlatinumZealot]

Agree with most of your post, however I don't recommend you touch the bottom tank of a radiator when the engine is at full lot. I have measured these temperatures and can assure you that there can be as little as 5*C difference when the thermostat is open and the engine is revving hard.

I am only experienced with street cars of course. No where near on the limit driving either!
It is all about the design point of the radiator.

I agree the water has a high heat capacity so yes the temperature drop is much less than the air side of the inter-cooler. And the water may be no where as hot as the air its cooling. The radiator now might have a different design point. But I think it will have a larger temperature drop than in the intercooler.