2014 Abu Dhabi GP - Yas Marina

[Richard]

Good point about pit lane starts. I think it's first come first served. You sometimes see a driver at the line really early to try and get to the front. So it's common sense for RB to let the one with the fastest time go first.... and also common sense for the person leaving next year to go last!

[djos]

I don't rate Vettel very high, but his dominance in a car that had a much smaller gap compared to the opposition was much executed much better.

One big difference is that Vettel had number 1 driver status and a relatively weak team mate. The Mercedes drivers had to fight each other for every pole, every point.

Also, with Vettel looking so poor this season one is tempted to ask whether he was actually getting everything out if his dominant car. Perhaps it was actually more dominant than we saw but he didn't extract it all.

I think calling Webber weak is unfair, the reality is, and I'm a huge fan, he was past his F1 prime in his last 2 years and could not adapt to the Pirelli tire lotto.

[djos]

It's difficult to predict it. He has a very tough competitor in the same car. Nico Rosberg will come back stronger next year. Nico never had a teammate in F1 that realistically outperformed him, meaning all those years in f1 he never had a bigger incentive before then he currently has, to work harder and become better then ever before.
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Mate, you forget his time with Webber at Williams. Webber won the points and qually battle iirc (2006).

EDIT: Btw even Nico rated Webber as a tougher opponent that Shuey - Shuey should have never tried to make a comeback imo.

[WaikeCU]

Would you say that Rosberg can only win in perfect conditions that suits him? I believe that Hamilton has the edge in this, that he can pull something out of the bag even when conditions aren't going his way.

[komninosm]

How is that a remarkable and flawless season for anyone else other than the technical team who built this car?
Both of them made huge mistakes and,

What huge mistakes did Hamilton and Rosberg make?
And do you mean the technical team that had HUGE car failures and pit errors?
I detect sour grapes and hate.

I think calling Webber weak is unfair, the reality is, and I'm a huge fan, he was past his F1 prime in his last 2 years and could not adapt to the Pirelli tire lotto.

You're just being pedantic. His argument is solid. You agree Webber was past his prime so he was in fact weak during the time period that matters for his argument.

Nice quote from Kubica,

"As a kid, I didn't like pizza, but I remember often going out for dinner with Lewis and Nico," former F1 race winner and rally driver Robert Kubica, who raced the pair in 2000, told BBC Sport. "They would even have races to eat pizza, always eating two at a time.

"There was always competition. They always wanted to win, to beat each other. But they didn't fight. It was friendly competition. There was always laughing afterwards.
"We had so much fun. We were friends. It was nice. We were normal kids. I have good memories of growing up with them."

Where did you find that? Is it true they grew up together? Sounds fishy

I know, I don't believe Merc would be stupid enough to cheat like that, but you must admit the choice of words were odd and the desperation in Hams voice made it sound like he had no choice in whether or not the engine would be turned up

What choice of words? You're reaching for straws.

[SectorOne]

Where did you find that? Is it true they grew up together? Sounds fishy

BBC article, i think you are taking the growing up comment too literally.
They raced against each other as kids so they spent some time together, hence Kubica talking about his memories from that time.

[notsofast]

What's the age cut-off for the young drivers test going on right now at Yas Marina? Seems like it might be 87 or thereabouts?

[djos]

You're just being pedantic. His argument is solid. You agree Webber was past his prime so he was in fact weak during the time period that matters for his argument.
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Show me another "weak" driver that can overtake Alonso thru eau rouge the way Webber did in 2013?

Interestingly Nico Rosberg rates Webber as a tougher Team mate than Shuey ... How about that for a "weak" driver eh?

http://www.grandprix247.com/2012/02/23/ ... -teammate/

[Kai]

You're just being pedantic. His argument is solid. You agree Webber was past his prime so he was in fact weak during the time period that matters for his argument.
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Show me another "weak" driver that can overtake Alonso thru eau rouge the way Webber did in 2013?

Interestingly Nico Rosberg rates Webber as a tougher Team mate than Shuey ... How about that for a "weak" driver eh?

http://www.grandprix247.com/2012/02/23/ ... -teammate/

If you are so adamant webber isnt a weak driver. Vettel must be a super star.

[djos]

If you are so adamant webber isnt a weak driver. Vettel must be a super star.

Vettel mastered the EBD and Pirreli tires better than anyone else, However most of us here still think Alonso is the better driver despite having less WDC's.

[NathanOlder]

Webber is/was weak.IIRC didn't he have 2 years alongside DC, when DC was at the end of his mediocre career andthey both beat each other 1 season each. Webber Iin his prime DC at the end. Yet it was a tie. Says it all really. He was average, and only good on his day.

[djos]

Webber is/was weak.IIRC didn't he have 2 years alongside DC, when DC was at the end of his mediocre career andthey both beat each other 1 season each. Webber Iin his prime DC at the end. Yet it was a tie. Says it all really. He was average, and only good on his day.

Before RedBull got the EBD working and Pirelli came along with their Crap tires, Webber was consistently as fast or faster than Vettel.

[Kingshark]

Would you say that Rosberg can only win in perfect conditions that suits him? I believe that Hamilton has the edge in this, that he can pull something out of the bag even when conditions aren't going his way.

I strongly disagree. Rosberg showed in Canada this year that he can be very competitive even when having to drive around multiple problems with his car.

Had Perez just held up Ricciardo a bit longer, Rosberg would have won that race despite driving 35 laps without electric power, and the last 25 laps with the brake bias all the way forward.

[NathanOlder]

Would you say that Rosberg can only win in perfect conditions that suits him? I believe that Hamilton has the edge in this, that he can pull something out of the bag even when conditions aren't going his way.

I strongly disagree. Rosberg showed in Canada this year that he can be very competitive even when having to drive around multiple problems with his car.

Had Perez just held up Ricciardo a bit longer, Rosberg would have won that race despite driving 35 laps without electric power, and the last 25 laps with the brake bias all the way forward.

Just shows how good that Mercedes is as a car. To remain fast enough to hold off the Force India was pretty impressive. Only a couple of cars were quick enough to pass Nico that day, and the Red Bull being 1 of them. The Force India couldn't keep up in S1& S2.

[Phil]

Webber is/was weak.

Personally, I think this comment doesn't do Webber enough justice. Yes, he had trouble with the EBD RedBull, just as Kimi and Schumacher had problems adapting to new Pirelli tyres - and just as Vettel this year is struggling with a non-EBD car. We need to accept that talent isn't a binary flag that is either 1 or 0. It's not a black and white world we live in and talent and ability shows itself in many different ways. Every driver outthere has a different skillset. Some are good at development (I hear Pedro de la Rosa is rated highly in this regard), some are good at exploiting a EBD car (Vettel), some just posses a natural ability that makes them perform well in even difficult cars. Webber, IMO, is a driver who clearly struggled with the EBD car and the Pirelli tyres. That however doesn't mean that he is a weak driver in any other circumstances - just that in that particular car and formula, he struggled against his team-mate. Two different drivers with different skillsets - which is why extraordinarely, before EBD got introduced, Webber was there and perhaps even at a advantage, where as once the EBD car became more relevant, Vettel started to shine. In this specific scenario, how is one better than the other? If anything - this only shows two different drivers with different skillsets. Only that one driver (Vettel) had the advantage of actually driving the car that exploited his skillset to the fullest - whereas Webber had to make due with what was given to him.

It's not much different with Schumacher. I don't for a second believe that his age made him slower when he made his come back with Mercedes. But he clearly struggled against a team-mate who is incredibly fast and more importantly, because of a new formula that is/was very different to what he raced under. Different tyres, different racing, completely different car characteristics. It's a pipe dream to believe you can take the current best driver (i.e. your favorite driver) and put him into any car, any formula and see him come out on top. Skillsets are different - and how they perform depends on what kind of skillset and ability they have, their adaptability and in what cars with which characteristics you place them.