New Refueling formula - Technical regulation - the Fuel pod

[PlatinumZealot]

One of the things that brought excitement to watching F1 was refueling. It used to be fun wondering what fuel load people were on before the race. Is he going for barnstorming first stint? Is he barging it till the end? The fuel you put in determined how fast and how you can go on a stint. 9 seconds of fuel or 5? And there there was the choreography to get the fuel hose to the car and plug it in, pump up and out again to the tick of the stop watch. Mistakes were made. Fires. Stuck cams. Blunt trauma to an innocent bystander. That was fun don't you agree?

I am proposing to bring back refueling but in a form that maintains the mystique and the fun but address the two biggest problems: Safety and Cost. I present to you. The fuel pod.

The fuel pod is a system of re-fueling that does not need a large, expensive pumping station, nor does it need a dangerous hose. The fuel pod is a three part system. The conventional Gas tank is the hub where two fuel pods slide into like cartridges. The two fuel pods couple to a mechanism in the base of the gas tank and can be slid in to lock and slid out with the twist of the handle. No spillage can occur with the fuel pod system. The gas tank holds 30 liters of fuel on its own. The two fuel pods can hold up to 50 litres of fuel. When a loaded fuel pod interlocks with the gas tank the one way vent opens and fuel drains down into the gas tank from the pod. The fuel pod has baffles that minimise sloshing.

Operation

In this refueling formula the team starts the driver with any level of fuel they want. 30 liters, 40.. 120liters.. up to 140 liters is possible. The amount of fuel you use determine how full your fuel pods are or are not... During a refueling pitstop the mechanics remove one or two fuel pods as he wishes. Then they load in a new fuel pod with the prescribed amount of fuel. This is the fun part. First there is the choreography to load the fuel pods... Imagine two refueling mechanics mounting the sides of the car to twist and remove in one fluid motion.. a spectacle. Then the second part.. since the fuel pods are switched out in one go, you can't use time to estimate how much fuel was added. Only the team knows how much fuel is in those preloaded fuel pods. The viewer just has to wait and see.

Safety

The fuel pods are all loaded in a safe room. There is no pumping equipment in vicinity of the garage. The fuel pods can even be transported with the fuel in them. Why stop there, if you are an arrogant computer slave team like Mclaren and you are confident in your strategy before the race the fuel pods pre-filled before the race starts . The fuel pods are built to the highest safety standards. The fuel coupling is double sealed. The coupling mechanism is durable and cannot spark or gash. No fuel is spilt during the transfer and the chance being clobbered by a 6 inch hose is nil.

The fuel pod is my answer to bring back more fun in watching formula 1.

See the concept drawings below. If you are interested in inve$ting in my proposal to Bernie please pm. Serious $$$...errr.. investors only.

[Manoah2u]

i'm no expert on this, but i have a feeling that because of all the electric systems aboard, the FIA would be keen to keep the possibility of in-race fueling away, i don't know the effects of fuel spilling on the car when it's under 'current'. The important factor is not all the safety grids that would theoretically prevent stuff from happening; the thing is the inherent human 'imperfection' that is always present; pitstops are a stressfull moment for all parties involved.

They want to set the fastest time, and are on constant pressure to perform when the car comes in. Just look at the pitstop of kimi; unsafe release and the ease on which it occurred. And ferrari aren't amateurs. It's pressure, stress, and human errors and imperfection all in one single moment where every millisecond counts. that's a potential danger for unwanted situations. And thats all in seemingly 'perfect' circumstances.
now imagine refuelling after some race contact with all the unknowns.

Most of all, it'll never happen in todays F1 because it's completely insane to have a car refuel during a max. 2 hour race of 100kgs of fuel. Just think about the 'gas mileage' and F1's intentions of becoming 'greener', AND in a world where the automobile industry HAS to move from fossil fuels to alternatives; electricity.

it's just not even a concideration. It just won't happen.

I think the tire strategies and mandated tire usage is enough. We have pitstops.

[Tim.Wright]

You don't see any safety issues with having multiple mechanics rapidly moving about these 40-50kg pods of fuel in a tiny box with the driver's trigger finger itching on the throttle to get away the millisecond the pod is installed?

[poolboy67]

this refueling method is too slow for f1.

(this is in the event of raised fuel flow limit)
here's what i would do:
max 70l tanks
mandatory complete refuel during race
fuel hose system allowed
mandatory electronic failsafe. this failsafe communicates with the car comparing measurements of the amount of fuel gone into the car at the hose, and at the tank. this system would not let the hose go untill the tank has been fully refueled and there no longer is pressure in the fuel hose. a return/pressure release valve opens right after the tank has been refueled, ensuring there's no chance for spillage. if the electronic system fails to let the hose go from the car, there would be a mechanical override that does the exact same prosedures. a go light would be on the hose, indicatin refueling completion.

the old hose system was completely manual, and therefore prone to operator failures.
the hose system can be safe, if the human element will be removed from it.
but this would then also mean that the driver cannot take off before the hose has come off.

IIRC refueling was banned because of drivers taking off withthe hose still fully attatched, knoking mechanics down.

[Pingguest]

I don't want drivers to gain or lose positions by pit stop strategies. The refueling ban is a step in the right direction, but in my opinion tyres should last the entire race. Let drivers pass on-track.

[ringo]

What i would do is make the pods be a part of the car. Remove the used ones then insert and lock in the full ones. This is much safer.
Refueling needs to return IMO. an F1 car will be much more fuel efficient if it weighed 70kgs less at any given time.
Also the cars will be faster throughout the race distance, and the tyres can be made grippier because of the reduced weight.

strategy is just too predictable nowadays.You basically know the outcome after the first pitstop. So again, bring back refueling!!

[Vettel Maggot]

Where is the air going that's coming out of the tank? Also have you ever tried lifting something so heavy and bulky on that kind of an angle? I do at work and it ain't pretty.

[PlatinumZealot]

Thats the interesting part. U dont have to fill it to fifty kilograms. You can do 25 kg on both sides. Or use two guys to lift or a have two your mechanics do strength training.. These class of mechanics... I would call "bruisers" or "lumber jacks"

The venting of the tank and pods is easily solved. This would be similar too the old fuel hoses.

this refueling method is too slow for f1.

(this is in the event of raised fuel flow limit)
here's what i would do:
max 70l tanks
mandatory complete refuel during race
fuel hose system allowed
mandatory electronic failsafe. this failsafe communicates with the car comparing measurements of the amount of fuel gone into the car at....

Your system is very transparent. Oponents know how much fuel you are injecting.

And something like 9 seconds of fuel will tske longer than inserting the pods.

Also your system will still be heavy and expensive. The fuel rigs were the most expnsive and heavy single peice equipment iN the garage that was one of the reasons for banning them.

So you address safety very well but the other two aspects of entertainment aNd cost....

[PlatinumZealot]

i'm no expert on this, but i have a feeling that because of all the electric systems aboard, the FIA would be keen to keep the possibility of in-race fueling away, i don't know the effects of fuel spilling on the car when it's under 'current'. The important factor is not all the safety grids that would theoretically prevent stuff from happening; the thing is the inherent human 'imperfection' that is always present; pitstops are a stressfull moment for all parties involved.

They want to set the fastest time, and are on constant pressure to perform when the car comes in. Just look at the pitstop of kimi; unsafe release and the ease on which it occurred. And ferrari aren't amateurs. It's pressure, stress, and human errors and imperfection all in one single moment where every millisecond counts. that's a potential danger for unwanted situations. And thats all in seemingly 'perfect' circumstances.
now imagine refuelling after some race contact with all the unknowns.

Most of all, it'll never happen in todays F1 because it's completely insane to have a car refuel during a max. 2 hour race of 100kgs of fuel. Just think about the 'gas mileage' and F1's intentions of becoming 'greener', AND in a world where the automobile industry HAS to move from fossil fuels to alternatives; electricity.

it's just not even a concideration. It just won't happen.

I think the tire strategies and mandated tire usage is enough. We have pitstops.

Point noted. But it can still hapen. the fuel cannisters can be built to UL standards. There could be an argument that refueling reducess mechanic stress levels because the pit stop wil be a few soconds longer. And regards to fuelef efficiency; ruelling is more fuel efficient actually as the car travels with less weight.

[PlatinumZealot]

You don't see any safety issues with having multiple mechanics rapidly moving about these 40-50kg pods of fuel in a tiny box with the driver's trigger finger itching on the throttle to get away the millisecond the pod is installed?

Thanks for the feedback. Funny images come to mind. Haha.A pedal happy driver flooring a few milliseconds too soon You say? ehe. Yeah that can be a problem. I believ F1 is not a bed of roses thwre will be danger or we would have kids driving the cars... But that problem can be fixed by kill switching the driveline when the pods are not locked in.

[langwadt]

Where is the air going that's coming out of the tank? Also have you ever tried lifting something so heavy and bulky on that kind of an angle? I do at work and it ain't pretty.

they do it every weekend in Nascar, the fuel cans are I think 12 gallons, and ~2 gallons/sec, that's about 2/3 the rate
of what F1 used to have (12liter/sec).
I'm sure F1 could come up with something slightly faster and much more expensive

[poolboy67]

the point of my idea was to remove strategizing the fuel aspect. yes other teams would know how much fuel is going into other cars, because all cars have to do a complete refuel. therefore it is irrelevant to know how much they're refueling. the other thing is, since the fuel tank is limited to 70kg, drivers would absolutely have to come in to refuel. and when they do, they'd get enough fuel to go to the end of the race without saving fuel. the total fuel allowed for race then would be 140kg, which is absolutely enough so that teams could run their cars without saving fuel. in fact they would benefit from using up the fuel as fast as possible, because the car would keep getting lighter, but without worrying of running out of fuel.

second thing i would mandate, is 2 pitstops per race, one tyre compound per race and tyres lasting as grippy as possible untill those pitstops, but that's off topic.

what i hate about f1 now, is the stupid tyre wear and fuel usage strategizing. the cars/drivers are not maxing out during the race.
pitstops are too quick, and provide minimum entertainment for spectators.

i want to see drivers battling out in the track, not in the pit stops. i want to see the drivers actually taking their cars to the limit, lap after lap.
i want to see artificial racing gone! and as the pit stops are essential to f1, i want to see the entertainment value of them improved, as well as safety.
if refueling was brought back, then the tyre people would have more time to make sure the wheels are properly attatched. now one tiny mistake basicly means a DNF, like last weekend with raikkonen. but the actual refueling has to be safe. and to me that means removing the human element from it.

[bdr529]

Where is the air going that's coming out of the tank? Also have you ever tried lifting something so heavy and bulky on that kind of an angle? I do at work and it ain't pretty.

My thoughts exactly, I'v seen enough 5 gallon cans of solvent to last me a life time, And like yourself, I can't see leaning over the cars side pod with essentially a 5 gallon jug being the safest thing to do, a refueling hose would be a better option.

they do it every weekend in Nascar, the fuel cans are I think 12 gallons, and ~2 gallons/sec, that's about 2/3 the rate
of what F1 used to have (12liter/sec).
I'm sure F1 could come up with something slightly faster and much more expensive

The benefit of refueling a stockcar is the ease of the refueling, it's just like all of us at the gas station, standing straight up, and not leaned over the car. also any fuel spilt falls on the ground and not on any thing hot like the exhaust or engine, and nascar drivers leave the pits with the refueling can stuck in the car quite often, real not the safest thing to do

[PlatinumZealot]

Interesting picture. Everyone notice how burly the fuel man is? Definitely not a job for pansies. That's the same sort of guys who would be loading the fuel pods. They do have a choice of loading less than the full compliment of fuel. If your race is a two stop, something 20 liters in each pod. Or 40 liters in one if you don't want to bother load both sides. It is quite flexible.

[bdr529]

Interesting picture. Everyone notice how burly the fuel man is? Definitely not a job for pansies. That's the same sort of guys who would be loading the fuel pods. They do have a choice of loading less than the full compliment of fuel. If your race is a two stop, something 20 liters in each pod. Or 40 liters in one if you don't want to bother load both sides. It is quite flexible.

45 liters/12 gallons of gas in one of the nascar refueling cans would weigh around 34 kg/74 lbs.