2015 Spanish Grand Prix - Circuit de Catalunya - 8-10 May

[George-Jung]

No he didn't. Hamilton never made a comment about his tyres being destroyed due to the dirty air. He constantly broke into the 2 second dirty air barrier. Hamilton's problem was struggling to pass a car quicker in a straight line around a circuit where overtaking is traditionally difficult. Not the same at all.

The Ferrari wasn't that much faster in a straight line, Vettel had a better exit in the last turn than Hamilton had.. which Hamilton couldn't make up for on the straights.

[mikeerfol]

Anyone got any testing info, Autosport doesn't seem to be covering it, Crash.net has live updates but no lap times.

Skysports has a live as well here but nothing serious as well

[Juzh]

hahaha why exactly does anyone think ferrari was faster on the straights? Who came up with this anyway? Please some solid answers. Preferably numbers.

Top 6 cars trough speed traps in the race were merc powered. And in fact during qualifying 7 out of 8 merc powered cars were fastest trough the start/finish line speed trap (FI was faster than a ferrari).

The Ferrari wasn't that much faster in a straight line, Vettel had a better exit in the last turn than Hamilton had.. which Hamilton couldn't make up for on the straights.

They weren't faster at all. Because last corner is not flat anymore (in the race) the car behind will always lose out to the car in front. If hamilton was losing so much he couldn't get passed a car on average 0.8s slower, then he stood no chance against a car with the same speed as his. Deal with it already.

[SectorOne]

Ferrari clocked the fastest speed on the finish line in the race, narrowly edging Williams.
FIA Maximum Speeds PDF document.

[George-Jung]

.. then he stood no chance against a car with the same speed as his. Deal with it already.

I wasn't talking about the Rosberg vs. Hamilton part..

[Jordan44]

No he didn't. Hamilton never made a comment about his tyres being destroyed due to the dirty air. He constantly broke into the 2 second dirty air barrier. Hamilton's problem was struggling to pass a car quicker in a straight line around a circuit where overtaking is traditionally difficult. Not the same at all.

The Ferrari wasn't that much faster in a straight line, Vettel had a better exit in the last turn than Hamilton had.. which Hamilton couldn't make up for on the straights.

Regardless, my point was that the incident in China and Lewis being unable to overtake here are unrelated. But for some reason people feel the need to bring it up.

[iotar__]

Ferrari clocked the fastest speed on the finish line in the race, narrowly edging Williams.
FIA Maximum Speeds PDF document.

This document: http://www.fia.com/file/27544/download?token=WF5acrm- ?
7 K. RAIKKONEN 282.3
2 77 V. BOTTAS 282.1
6 44 L. HAMILTON 281.3
9 6 N. ROSBERG 278.8
10 5 S. VETTEL 278.7

It's interesting that once LH couldn't overtake slower Vettel (quite normal, it can always happen the other way, nothing to discuss except for double standards) Barcelona became new Monaco and is now an impossible to overtake track. Fine but A. they know that so there's an extra pressure on qualifying and start for everybody B. it was lucky that it was the race where Ferrari was the slowest this season which enabled alternative strategy to work and not to lose more points to Rosberg. The opposite of Bahrain.

I don't remember Rosberg getting much track related credit last season despite receiving the second best strategy and only couple of laps at the end, an overtake on track with the same tyres was the first option on Sunday.

[F1NAC]

Ferrari clocked the fastest speed on the finish line in the race, narrowly edging Williams.
FIA Maximum Speeds PDF document.

This document: http://www.fia.com/file/27544/download?token=WF5acrm- ?
7 K. RAIKKONEN 282.3
2 77 V. BOTTAS 282.1
6 44 L. HAMILTON 281.3
9 6 N. ROSBERG 278.8
10 5 S. VETTEL 278.7

It's interesting that once LH couldn't overtake slower Vettel (quite normal, it can always happen the other way, nothing to discuss except for double standards) Barcelona became new Monaco and is now an impossible to overtake track. Fine but A. they know that so there's an extra pressure on qualifying and start for everybody B. it was lucky that it was the race where Ferrari was the slowest this season which enabled alternative strategy to work and not to lose more points to Rosberg. The opposite of Bahrain.

I don't remember Rosberg getting much track related credit last season despite receiving the second best strategy and only couple of laps at the end, an overtake on track with the same tyres was the first option on Sunday.

hamilton in intermediate 2 270? 11 kph faster than kvyat on 2nd place

[Juzh]

hamilton in intermediate 2 270? 11 kph faster than kvyat on 2nd place

Speed trap is just before braking zone. Some brake before it, some after.

Ferrari clocked the fastest speed on the finish line in the race, narrowly edging Williams.
FIA Maximum Speeds PDF document.

Sure, lets ignore obvious slipstream effects (late in the race for RAI, new tires). C'mon sector. That's why you look at qualifying S3 speed trap for a more representative acceleration figures. And figures are clear in this case.

[SectorOne]

Sure, lets ignore obvious slipstream effects (late in the race for RAI, new tires). C'mon sector. That's why you look at qualifying S3 speed trap for a more representative acceleration figures. And figures are clear in this case.

You´re saying Hamilton had no slipstreaming in the race and no new tires late in the race?
We can look at the real speed trap of Qualifying, the one at the end of the straight.

Williams ahead of Ferrari, Ferrari ahead of Mercedes.
Would be nice to see the real speed trap for the race as well, not sure why they don´t provide that.

[Juzh]

Sure, lets ignore obvious slipstream effects (late in the race for RAI, new tires). C'mon sector. That's why you look at qualifying S3 speed trap for a more representative acceleration figures. And figures are clear in this case.

You´re saying Hamilton had no slipstreaming in the race and no new tires late in the race?
We can look at the real speed trap of Qualifying, the one at the end of the straight.

Williams ahead of Ferrari, Ferrari ahead of Mercedes.
Would be nice to see the real speed trap for the race as well, not sure why they don´t provide that.

Vettel with the new updates was slower than hamilton and rosberg in Q end of straight speed trap and crucially was slower over the start/finish line. So what does that tell us? Ferrari was slower than mercedes troughout entire straight. You can't say spin this any other way.

As for race speed traps, guess which engine is in top 6 positions (click on speed trap section):
http://www.fia.com/events/formula-1-wor ... fication-6
Must be a coincidence, right?
Still want to have a go at this?

[tomazy]

They do, just have to find it

http://www.fia.com/events/formula-1-wor ... fication-6

Just click on speed trap.

Fastest Williams 341.1km/h, Mercedes 341.0km/h and Ferrari 338.9km/h.

EDIT: I see I have been 3mins too late

[dans79]

It doesn't matter what the speed trap says, as passing down the main strait requires a lot more than a good top speed. The last turn is down hill & high speed. This hurts the trailing car, because its' loosing down-force because of the dirty air generated by the car in front. Thus, the car in front pulls a gap at the start of the strait, and the trailing car pulls it back at the end of the strait because it's plain faster, has DRS advantage, or both.

To make a pass the lead car needs to make a mistake, have completely shot tires, or the trailing car needs to be significantly faster. The advantage required, is probably over a seconds a lap.

[Gaz.]

It doesn't matter what the speed trap says, as passing down the main strait requires a lot more than a good top speed. The last turn is down hill & high speed. This hurts the trailing car, because its' loosing down-force because of the dirty air generated by the car in front. Thus, the car in front pulls a gap at the start of the strait, and the trailing car pulls it back at the end of the strait because it's plain faster, has DRS advantage, or both.

To make a pass the lead car needs to make a mistake, have completely shot tires, or the trailing car needs to be significantly faster. The advantage required, is probably over a seconds a lap.

Quite, a 2.5kph potential advantage is meaningless because of the last corner.

[Sevach]

I still dont understand why Sebastian was so slow with the hard tyres, because they worked well with Kimi. He was slower than Mercedes, his teammate, both Williams, and in some laps even than some of the other cars. Terrible.

Well, once Lewis got past him via the undercut with fresher Medium Tyres there was simply nothing to gain for him by pushing. Would have just put strain on the engine and the rest of the car plus his Fuel usage was a bit too high at that time. My conclusion: He was possibly just in Cruise Mode.

On a tight circuit, offering none to limited opportunities for overtaking (unless vast difference in tyre life), Lewis' chance of winning the race was gone as soon as he fell behind Vettel. In Monza last year though, a similar situation, he fell back to 4th, but came back due to the overtaking opportunities the track offers. Back then he managed to beat the equal car, but here he had no chance to beating a much slower car in front and had to rely on undercut. His only chance was to extend his second stint on hards to the end of race, which was not permissible, even if he would have wished. That would have either given him a win, the chances of which were remote, or he would fallen back to 3rd or even 4th.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2015/05/10/m ... -hamilton/

Hamilton only got infront of Rosberg because Mercedes compromised him a bit, the race was never on.