Espionage at Ferrari and McLaren

[checkered]

McLaren will

not appeal the latest WMSC decision:

McLaren Racing has notified the FIA of its intention not to appeal the verdict of the World Motor Sport Council, as announced on 13th September 2007.

Having now had time to study the judgement of the World Motor Sport Council with its lawyers and shareholders, McLaren thinks it is in the best interests of the sport, and its goal of winning races and world championships, not to appeal.

It is clear from the full judgement that the World Motor Sport Council concluded that the charge that a McLaren employee had "unauthorised possession of documents and confidential information” was proven.

Despite the existence of no evidence that the information was applied, tested or shared with the engineering team (which it was not), this possession constitutes a breach of the Code. To our regret and embarrassment, the content of the previously unknown emails demonstrated possession not being limited to a single person, albeit unsanctioned in any way by the team. For this breach of Article 151c, a very heavy penalty has been imposed on the team.

The major principle of the issue for McLaren is: this information was not used to gain advantage on its cars.

Moving forwards, and in consultation with our shareholders, we will now review and further strengthen our internal compliance structures and processes.

Ron Dennis said: “We believe the time has come to put this huge distraction behind us. McLaren wants to win races and world championships. We are fortunate to have, and continue to receive, unwavering support from our employees, sponsor partners and Formula 1 fans across the world – all of whom are equally keen that we totally focus on winning this year’s Drivers’ Championship and the remaining three races of the season.”

- ENDS -

http://www.mclaren.com/latestnews/mclaren.php

What I'm slightly worried about is that some court cases and investigations are still going on unabated despite the matter now seemingly being put behind as far as the FIA is concerned (well, them going to investigate Macca's 2008 car notwithstanding). Hopefully all of this "extracurricular" activity is wrapped up as efficiently and sensibly as possible.

[monkeyboy1976]

I think the remaining investigations are civil and criminal ones againts Stepney and Coughlan who are no longer employed in F1. It's Ferrari's own battle outside F1 now.
Maybe a deal has been done between McLaren and Ferrari that anything else that comes out of these ongoing things won't be brought back to the FIA to further punish McLaren.
I still think that Ferrari have got away with not being charged by the FIA for bringing the sport into distripute by the actions of their employee. The case against McLaren was partly based on the action of it's employees so why should Ferrari also not recieve some attention from the FIA?
Oh yeah, I forgot

[walter]

I still think that Ferrari have got away with not being charged by the FIA for bringing the sport into distripute by the actions of their employee. The case against McLaren was partly based on the action of it's employees so why should Ferrari also not recieve some attention from the FIA?
Oh yeah, I forgot

[bhall]

Yeah, that Ferrari are somehow at fault for "allowing" their intellectual property to be stolen has always been one of the more ridiculous notions of this whole case.

[checkered]

Sorry mate I think you need to read this.

Without going too much into the possible ironies of that statement, I respectfully suggest that you consider posting any pictorials, in which the content isn't for the mainpart comprised of factual information and/or the pertinence of which is debatable, to a thread called "Caption Competition". A basic grasp on the demands of humor is a plus, of course. You can find the latest installments here:

viewtopic.php?t=1843

Of course everybody takes liberties here. Generally it takes some experience to do so with a certain situation awareness and I'm sure even a superficial look will reveal that most participants aren't here by chance nor some sort of tourists ogling at the natives and dropping off hand comments about them. It's generally a good idea to get one's bearings first when in a new environment.

Most debaters here have followed and participated in this particular thread from the beginning. It'll help in your contributions, I'm sure, if you start there.

[Carlos]

I agree with checkered wholeheartedly. I don't speak in sign language, with flash cards or graphics; perhaps with a poor grasp of syntax,grammar and spelling. I may have to use the above mentioned methods one day due to senility or incapacitation ... Mikep99, you will be the first to know when either occurs, neither has yet. Mikep99 if you suffer from either, my apologies for an insensitive reference. checkered's suggestion is a good one, you may not have noticed the thread Caption Competition. I would offer this suggestion to everyone. Just as some people are tempted to make up cutzy, provoking graphics - I have a temptation to flash my bum - but I resist, out of a sense of civilty.

I am looking forward to the graphics that may soon appear; never under estimating the lowest common denominator of human nature... which I share.

[megz]

A lack of an appeal could be seen as a sort of admittance of guilt could it not?

[Tom]

A lack of appeal could also be seen as trying to keep ones head down and out of unwanted trouble and media attention, could it not?

After all, do you think 'McLaren Wil Not Appeal' is going to make the headlines or 'McLaren Appeal Results In "07/08 Ban!'?

[Rob W]

A lack of appeal could also be seen as trying to keep ones head down and out of unwanted trouble and media attention, could it not?

I think the lack of appeal is part of F1s policy of saying quietly to people who appeal: "if you appeal, you will lose - and we'll double your sentence.."

Same reason no-one else seems to appeals most things in F1 (BAR's fuel-tank issue for example).

Rob W

[wunderkind]

A lack of appeal could also be seen as trying to keep ones head down and out of unwanted trouble and media attention, could it not?

I think the lack of appeal is part of F1s policy of saying quietly to people who appeal: "if you appeal, you will lose - and we'll double your sentence.."

Same reason no-one else seems to appeals most things in F1 (BAR's fuel-tank issue for example).

Rob W

Ferrari appealed................................................

I think it is interesting that Luca di Montezemolo has retained an extremely low profile throughout this affair. LDM, being the wily old political fox, knew it would be a personal and professional mistake to take on Mercedes Benz and McLaren himself.

You could be sure that there will be retribution to Ferrari, and probably Fiat, for this. Fiat will not be part of the engine alliance pact between certain European manufacturers (Mercedes Benz, BMW, Peugeot)

LDM relied on Jean Todt to get even with McLaren. But I cant help but feel that Jean Todt overplayed his hand.

[wrk]

Sep.22 (GMM) With seemingly no end to the espionage saga, it now emerges that F1's governing body earlier this week contributed to the widespread distribution of dozens more McLaren and Ferrari secrets.

A day before releasing the nearly 200 pages of World Motor Sport Council transcripts to the public on Wednesday, the FIA had sent the documents to both teams so that confidential technical and financial information could be redacted.

But when the PDF documents were initially made available on the internet, it soon became clear that the blackened sections could easily be revealed if copy-pasted into another text editor.

The offending copies were quickly removed from the FIA website and replaced.

But a plethora of sensitive information, including not only technical team and car details but private figures such as suspended McLaren chief designer Mike Coughlan's annual salary, and the precise weight distribution of the MP4-22 and also systems adopted by Ferrari, is therefore now widely known in various corners of the formula one world.

The philosophy of variable brake balance systems on both the McLaren and the Ferrari was also inadvertently revealed by the FIA, as well as details about Ferrari's unique method of inflating its tyres, and other secrets.

We can confirm that some of those in possession of the formerly private information have been approached by motor racing figures asking to be let in on the secrets.

An FIA spokeswoman admits that the Paris based Federation is aware of the mistake.

She would not comment further, but the FIA confirmed last week that the transcripts had been recorded by a professional stenographer and formatted by an independent transcription company.

[checkered]

Sep.22 (GMM) With seemingly no end to the espionage saga, it now emerges that F1's governing body earlier this week contributed to the widespread distribution of dozens more McLaren and Ferrari secrets.

Yes, I was LMAO

(in a slightly nervous fashion) when I (immediately) noticed the information wasn't actually protected at all ... happened to download the documents right after those came online. I didn't further the information to anyone, though, but thought about informing the FIA about the mistake. It became evident very soon that many others had already beaten me to it, so it became a bit academic to me. The cat was out of the bag and that had nothing to do with me or my actions anyway.

I'm sure all the teams have the info now, there are many news outlets with the originals available from what I have understood from conversations here. Can't believe some F1 teams would've missed this in the first place, many had representation in the hearing itself, right? On a couple of discussion boards there have been quite interesting conversations about the possible specifics of mechanically load-adaptive and/or mechanically delay-variable (non-ABS) brake bias systems already. You don't really need much to go on to develop your own version, that much is evident. Just the concept and the knowledge that it has the seal of approval of the technical delegates and passes scrutineering.

I wouldn't overstate the significance of the information, though. To me there was nothing that was really outside the realm of developmental exrapolation and imagination.

[wrk]

if you get the urge feel free....

mjack60@hotmail.com

[mikep99]

Flavio is a strait shooter & says it like it is.


Briatore : Little sympathy for McLaren plight
24/09/07 16:09



Flavio Briatore says a new espionage saga involving the Renault team is in the FIA's hands.

It was reported recently that, upon switching from McLaren to Renault, engineer Phil Mackereth took with him three disks of technical information about the Woking based team.

In an interview with Sport Auto, Renault Team Principal Briatore played down the comparison with the Stepneygate saga.

"What happened is what happens probably all the time," he said. "It cannot be controlled. I don't want to say anything, because it is now something for the FIA to judge."

But Briatore suggests that the information was only leaked to the media in the midst of McLaren's deep involvement in the spy saga.

"They made noises that something with us is not right. Why did they say that to the media? If they have proof then they should just give it to the FIA.
"We have given everything that we know about the case to the FIA and also to McLaren," he added.


Briatore declined to answer whether he feels compassion for Ron Dennis after his team was fined $100m and kicked out of the 2007 constructors' title.

"I don't want to play the judge," said the Italian. "If Ron Dennis believes firmly that he did nothing wrong, then he should appeal.

"I can only comment on what I see. Last year McLaren were nowhere, and now they drive for the title. I am not the one who can judge from where this performance jump came from.

"This was not a case of an engineer carrying a bit of data from another team. If you read the detail of the World Council meetings, it becomes clear that a constant flow of information took place over a period of months," Briatore said.
Source GMM
CAPSIS International



The last few paragraphs make perfect scents to me and hit the spot I think.

[Rob W]

...Last year McLaren were nowhere, and now they drive for the title. I am not the one who can judge from where this performance jump came from.

"This was not a case of an engineer carrying a bit of data from another team. If you read the detail of the World Council meetings, it becomes clear that a constant flow of information took place over a period of months," Briatore said.

The last few paragraphs make perfect scents to me and hit the spot I think.

..Even thought McLaren were looking solid in pre-season testing and in the first few races of the year - long, long before anything they gained from the information about Ferrari could possibly have be used to improve their car.

Flavio need to just face the reality that the Renault technical team totally dropped the ball on this year's car.

Rob W