Toro Rosso STR11 Ferrari Speculation Thread

[hemichromis]

Anyone seen this:

http://en.f1i.com/news/40330-marchionne ... rosso.html

Looks like Marchionne wanted Alfa Romeo to be an independent engine supplier but Red Bull wouldn't pay 30,000,000 euros for development costs.

Not sure i believe Toro Rosso would turn it down.

[F1NAC]

https://twitter.com/ToroRossoSpy/status ... 9730666497

[seezung]

Heya guys, new on this forum and really enjoying all the insight and technical discussions over here

Have a question about your expectations for the STR11, saw in the STR10 topic the following post:

Just imagine an STR11 with a Ferrari Pu... thanks to the V-shaped cooler and the V-integrated Ferrari intercooler, that car could have the tiniest sidepods ever

Would like to hear your opinions about design changes to the STR11 due to the the 2015 Ferrari engine fitted in....
We know the wheelbase has increased, which doesnt necessarily has to be a good thing, but do you guys think there could be benefits as well from the Ferrari 2015 engine layout?

[turbof1]

Heya guys, new on this forum and really enjoying all the insight and technical discussions over here

Have a question about your expectations for the STR11, saw in the STR10 topic the following post:

Just imagine an STR11 with a Ferrari Pu... thanks to the V-shaped cooler and the V-integrated Ferrari intercooler, that car could have the tiniest sidepods ever

Would like to hear your opinions about design changes to the STR11 due to the the 2015 Ferrari engine fitted in....
We know the wheelbase has increased, which doesnt necessarily has to be a good thing, but do you guys think there could be benefits as well from the Ferrari 2015 engine layout?

Hello seezung and welcome to ftechnical.

Aerodynamically speaking there might be advantages in terms of cooling. If I got the right impression, the Renault PU needed more cooling. The change can translate in less obstruction towards the diffuser floor and/or the rear wing.

However, Toro Rosso might not be able to full exploit this since the change got retified fairly late last year.

[seezung]

Found this as well:

https://twitter.com/ScarbsF1/status/695539965665665024

[Big Mangalhit]

Are you sure the Renault PU demanded less cooling then the 2015 ferrari pu? Because Ferrari did introduce that, widely praised, new cooling system in the side pods and also sauber seemed to have the biggest side pods of the paddock last year.

[turbof1]

Are you sure the Renault PU demanded less cooling then the 2015 ferrari pu? Because Ferrari did introduce that, widely praised, new cooling system in the side pods and also sauber seemed to have the biggest side pods of the paddock last year.

I think you readed my comment backwards :

If I got the right impression, the Renault PU needed more cooling.

[seezung]

Just quoted blackout, see below... I'm not sure if he is correct though....

Just imagine an STR11 with a Ferrari Pu... thanks to the V-shaped cooler and the V-integrated Ferrari intercooler, that car could have the tiniest sidepods ever

https://twitter.com/techF1LES/status/642399625446600704

[Big Mangalhit]

Are you sure the Renault PU demanded less cooling then the 2015 ferrari pu? Because Ferrari did introduce that, widely praised, new cooling system in the side pods and also sauber seemed to have the biggest side pods of the paddock last year.

I think you readed my comment backwards :

If I got the right impression, the Renault PU needed more cooling.

No, I just wrote mine backwards. I meant to say if you were sure that it demanded more cooling because of those reasons stated I thought that maybe (big maybe) the 2015 ferrari PU demanded more cooling provided by the new ferrari side pod vane thingy and saucer massive ones. What do you think?

[f1316]

Anyone seen this:

http://en.f1i.com/news/40330-marchionne ... rosso.html

Looks like Marchionne wanted Alfa Romeo to be an independent engine supplier but Red Bull wouldn't pay 30,000,000 euros for development costs.

Not sure i believe Toro Rosso would turn it down.

Don't completely understand it - wouldn't they just stick an Alfa badge on a Ferrari PU? Why would that cost 30 million euros? Surely there'd be no point developing a whole new, competing PU within the same company?

[adrianjordan]

Anyone seen this:

http://en.f1i.com/news/40330-marchionne ... rosso.html

Looks like Marchionne wanted Alfa Romeo to be an independent engine supplier but Red Bull wouldn't pay 30,000,000 euros for development costs.

Not sure i believe Toro Rosso would turn it down.

Don't completely understand it - wouldn't they just stick an Alfa badge on a Ferrari PU? Why would that cost 30 million euros? Surely there'd be no point developing a whole new, competing PU within the same company?

A separate development line would potentially give them ways to try different ideas without impacting on the Ferrari team's performance if they didn't work...

[f1316]

Anyone seen this:

http://en.f1i.com/news/40330-marchionne ... rosso.html

Looks like Marchionne wanted Alfa Romeo to be an independent engine supplier but Red Bull wouldn't pay 30,000,000 euros for development costs.

Not sure i believe Toro Rosso would turn it down.

Don't completely understand it - wouldn't they just stick an Alfa badge on a Ferrari PU? Why would that cost 30 million euros? Surely there'd be no point developing a whole new, competing PU within the same company?

A separate development line would potentially give them ways to try different ideas without impacting on the Ferrari team's performance if they didn't work...

Yeah I guess so. But then if it was totally separate, it would cost more than 30 million euros.

I guess they wouldn't want to start from scratch so it would be, what, the same last year's Ferrari PU that Torro Rosso are using as the base? Then Red Bull would have had basically the same situation as they have with TAG Renaults but with a more solid foundation?

If so I'm surprised they didn't go for it. Although I guess it was only on the table for Torro Rosso? Shame, could have been interesting if the Alfa/RB engine team (perhaps with Mario Illien still as consultant)
was allowed to compete with the Ferrari design.

[turbof1]

Are you sure the Renault PU demanded less cooling then the 2015 ferrari pu? Because Ferrari did introduce that, widely praised, new cooling system in the side pods and also sauber seemed to have the biggest side pods of the paddock last year.

I think you readed my comment backwards :

If I got the right impression, the Renault PU needed more cooling.

No, I just wrote mine backwards. I meant to say if you were sure that it demanded more cooling because of those reasons stated I thought that maybe (big maybe) the 2015 ferrari PU demanded more cooling provided by the new ferrari side pod vane thingy and saucer massive ones. What do you think?

Ferrari was claimed to have an innovative cooling solution, which Toro Rosso should be able to replicate. Ferrari's sidepods were quite tight yet barely ever needed further opening. Even in Malaysia, they did not have to make additional openings. I think concerning cooling the PU is quite compact. The one thing I see as a disadvantage is the water radiator which is placed quite high, raising the CoG.

I wouldn't take Sauber as a reference. They started with a very similar chassis to the 2014 one. It's a budget-restricted team which is not in the position to optimize cooling.

[Big Mangalhit]

I guess so. Especially if rumours from italy are true and they are increasing the cooling for this year contester maybe my whole premise is wrong. Anyway I am really curious to see how the ferrari PU (especially since it is the 2015) will behave in the STR. If it is only advantages or maybe some drawbacks in CoG and packaging, are they still gonna arrive with that awesome package?

Also is it plausible that if STR starts to get more consistent results than RB some money and in season development will be more focused in the traditionally B team?

The season can't start soon enough

[turbof1]

It's possible that cooling has to be increased due increased output. However, the same can happen with the Renault PU. Not that it matters; Toro Rosso will get the 2015 spec.

I am curious as well. I think Toro Rosso will outperform Red Bull. I don't think its budget will be increased on the short term; it is still a matter of prestige.