2016 McLaren F1 Team - Honda

[NL_Fer]

What just puzzles me while not an engine manufacturer, there must be allot of engine knowledge within McLaren. So when they convinced Honda to take the size zero route, there wasn't anybody within McLaren who said: Hey watch out, what we are asking is technicly, very hard to accomplish.

As well during the 2014 year, why did Honda not put some technicians on the grandstands to analyze the races. They would have discovered that Mercedes and Renault were runing with mgu-k enabled for almost all full throttle parts?

Even the racing engineers and drivers head hands-on exprerience with the Merc engine, they must have noticed the almost unlimited Mgu-k time.

[PlatinumZealot]

Assembling an engine is light years away from engineering and manufacturing one.

[Sayeman]

Manoah2u stop trying to be so patronising it really doesn't suit you.
Whatever your job is I'm assuming it's not a leading role in a Formula 1 team. I'm guessing part time in Burger King.

You really need to calm down. This Honda hate has gone too far. It's like the Mclaren guys can brag about the chassis all day long while the Honda fans can't even praise the PU without getting a telling off.
You should write Dennis a letter addressing your annoyance with Honda, see if he cares.
As i said before Mclaren needs Honda more than Honda needs Mclaren. Not like other manufacturers are waiting in the wing to get Mclaren's Power unit deal.

[alonsofan]

While arguing chassis vs engines, people so easily forget, that there are no restrictions on chassis development. The engine development is screwed up big time by the token system.

[Sayeman]

While arguing chassis vs engines, people so easily forget, that there are no restrictions on chassis development. The engine development is screwed up big time by the token system.

Also is Mobile 1 helping Honda as much as Shell helping ferrari or Petronas helping Mercedes?

[proteus]

First they lost Newey, than Paddy Lowe. This two loses of key people were like 2 torpedoes hitting a battleship. One hit into the steering and one in the middle of it. Right now they are crippled and needed of a repair. One positive thing is that they finally begun to start making evolutions of the car and not making a completely new one every season. The problem though is that this philosophy is going to last for only 1 instance (15-16), because of the arrival of new rules that come into the effect next year.

2017 will probably be a game changer for all of the teams. This year, their priority is to experiment as much as they can + bring home as much points as possible.

[Manoah2u]

First they lost Newey, than Paddy Lowe. This two loses of key people were like 2 torpedoes hitting a battleship. One hit into the steering and one in the middle of it...
... they finally begun to start making evolutions of the car and not making a completely new one every season.

2017 will probably be a game changer for all of the teams. This year, their priority is to experiment as much as they can + bring home as much points as possible.

this times 2.

still, about that '15 revolution with a '16 evolution quite frankly is yet another 'experiment' they are doing before going to have to go all over again as of '17. I've heard/read about 'experimenting' before and quite frankly, they've been experimenting too much.

the U-pod shape was 'revolutionary' and worked on 'some' level but did not leave room for improvement and was abandoned quickly. f-duct was played out fast as it was copied and it had potentially unsafe characterictics knowing the driver controls it by hand [pressure blockage] which means no hands on the wheel. I like the really really supertight packaging but it does not seem to bring the desired result, so would that make it yet another failed attempt on an experiment?

I really expected more from them this season, but i hope to see what their Spain update will do. It would be nice to see Alonso shine in his home crowd. God knows it's been too long since we've seen Alonso batteling @ front for the podium and the win, where he belongs. It's a bit boring without Alonso in the mix spicing things up. Hamilton vs Rosberg has been fun and ok the past years, and Vettel made a great effort in achieving his championship streak, but if i have to dig from memory, which could be well influenced though, last time i remember i felt excited untill the last lap of championship-deciding gp i was at the tip of my seat when Vettel pulled it in and Alonso lost being stuck behind Petrov. I would have loved more seeing a 1 on 1 side-by-side photofinish but that was major fun.

either way, it's still early in the season, so there's still much that can happen, though it's safe to say Mcl won't be running for the WDC or WCC this year.

[ME4ME]

I'm surprised Newey is brought up as a reason for Mclaren's lack of performance. Really? He left like 10+ years ago. Mclaren did fine until 2012, and it wasn't aero that caught them out initially. It was mechanical unreliability that caused all those DNF's for Button and Hamilton, which ultimately made the latter leave the team.

They then made the error of re-designing their car from the ground up for 2013. It ultimately cost Withmarsh his job. But at least lessons were learned.

Ron has identified and acknowledged that the Mclaren F1 team was functioning as an engineering operation, rather then a race oriented operation. Measures are put in place to reverse that, no doubt.

Mclaren has strengthened their aero-team. MP4-31 is the first car PP has been responsible for aero-wise. There is no indication that it is fundamentally flawed like the 2013 car was. Drivers seem happy with the car's characteristics, and it looks reasonably stable on track.

The ball is firmly at Honda's court now. They have to start delivering.

[Steven]

What just puzzles me while not an engine manufacturer, there must be allot of engine knowledge within McLaren. So when they convinced Honda to take the size zero route, there wasn't anybody within McLaren who said: Hey watch out, what we are asking is technicly, very hard to accomplish.
....

Please note that it was Honda that came up with the zero size concept, because they felt it would allow a better overall package while convinced it was not a limiting factor for their engine design.

[ME4ME]

What just puzzles me while not an engine manufacturer, there must be allot of engine knowledge within McLaren. So when they convinced Honda to take the size zero route, there wasn't anybody within McLaren who said: Hey watch out, what we are asking is technicly, very hard to accomplish.
....

Please note that it was Honda that came up with the zero size concept, because they felt it would allow a better overall package while convinced it was not a limiting factor for their engine design.

No offence, but I take Wazari's word for it that it was in fact Mclaren who came up with the Size0 concept. It was Honda's fault to accept it.

[zeph]

What just puzzles me while not an engine manufacturer, there must be allot of engine knowledge within McLaren. So when they convinced Honda to take the size zero route, there wasn't anybody within McLaren who said: Hey watch out, what we are asking is technicly, very hard to accomplish.
....

Please note that it was Honda that came up with the zero size concept, because they felt it would allow a better overall package while convinced it was not a limiting factor for their engine design.

No, it wasn't. Definitely McLaren's idea.

[PlatinumZealot]

People like to blame size zero when it has little to do with the lack of performance. The crux of honda's problem was that they underestimated the challenge and did not appoint the proper time, knowledge and funding to get it right at the onset.

[maguetox]

What just puzzles me while not an engine manufacturer, there must be allot of engine knowledge within McLaren. So when they convinced Honda to take the size zero route, there wasn't anybody within McLaren who said: Hey watch out, what we are asking is technicly, very hard to accomplish.
....

Please note that it was Honda that came up with the zero size concept, because they felt it would allow a better overall package while convinced it was not a limiting factor for their engine design.

No, it wasn't. Definitely McLaren's idea.

Mister Peter P. want it easy with the rear end so he pushed hard to have the infamous 0. Here we are almost two years later and we are still pushing to have a pretty decent aero.

[McG]

It's amazing the allegiance people show towards Honda when all they have done is drag McLaren down.

We have Honda themselves saying it's their fault. This site owner confirming it's Honda's fault.

But still there are a few who seem to lack common sense. Maybe they are just trolling. I don't think some actually watch F1, they just love to comment.

[erlik]

It's amazing the allegiance people show towards Honda when all they have done is drag McLaren down.

We have Honda themselves saying it's their fault. This site owner confirming it's Honda's fault.

But still there are a few who seem to lack common sense. Maybe they are just trolling. I don't think some actually watch F1, they just love to comment.

Common sense says it is 50-50 fault. McLaren proposed size 0 - Honda accepted, both sides fault. Now, Mclaren does not have best chassis - McLaren's fault, Honda does not have best engine - Honda 's fault. End of story, move on...