2016 Mercedes AMG Petronas F1 Team - Mercedes

[JCC]

It was quite some time since I posted here @ F1Tech, but after reading some of the latest posts in this thread, I think I might be able to add some value.. or not..

Anyways, I think that both of them were a bit too aggressive at Barcelona, and hence that, both has got to take their share of the responsibility too although I tend to think that Hamilton probably should have backed off there as he really wasn´t beside Rosberg when he closed the door. But we´re talking about split decision moments here, so I figure that we should give both drivers some leeway here. These things happens at times..

About their skill levels.. They´re both very good and both of them belong in a top team without a single doubt imo. It seems as Hamilton has more "natural" raw speed in him, but that Rosberg compensates for that with setup knowledge and work ethics. He also seems to have grown some balls this year too, which is about time to say the least.

They´ve been very close this year (too) during qualy and the fact that Hamilton is (said) to often have used Rosbergs settings lately indicates that Rosberg have an edge when it comes to that. Kind of reminds me of when Ronnie Peterson used to mess around with setup during practice, often being quite a bit of Fittipaldi´s pace until Chapman put his setup on Ronnie´s car and then he just blow Emo away. (Yes, I´m that old.. )

Not saying that Hamilton always has blown away Rosberg during qualy, just compering skill sets.

I should perhaps add that none of them are any of my fav-drivers (before I get flamed, lol), but I do respect and regard the both of them as very very good F1 drivers too.
...
About Hamiltons life style and stuff..

I think that leaving McLaren gave him the opportunity to explore life more and begin the (long) road to find his true nature so to speak. That takes time to do, we´ve all experienced that (well, us old fart´s here have anyways) And I think that it´s great to see him enjoying live the way he do although he might smile a bit later on life when he sees some old pics of himself in later years..
-Oh my.. did I really wear that.. but those girls was at least really hot, wasnt they?

Been there - done that..
...
But I can also see why Mercedes might not be all that happy about his life style choices. I mean, they are in the business of selling cars and I pretty sure that most of their customers aren´t rappers and probably aren´t all that into that life style either. Rosberg is on the other hand is married young father who seems to have both feet on the ground already, to which they most likely can relate a lot better to.

I mean, most Mercedes customers are probably and about my age, with good finances and a life style pretty far away from the rappers scene. Wearing nice suites instead of saggy pant´s and so on.. Me, I´m an old biker so I guess they wouldn´t be able relate to my life style either (understatement of the year). I´m just saying that from a pure business point of view, it probably makes more sense for Mercedes to keep Rosberg if they feel the need to split from one of them.

I know that many would get very upset if so, but I wouldn´t actually mind seeing Hamilton in a Ferrari, up against Vettel for instance. That would be bloody awesome imo. And come to think of it, Alonso vs Rosberg at Mercedes would be great to watch too. =D>
...
Short about Stewarts comment´s

I guess that journo´s ask´s him, not the other way around, and one must remember that F1 was really, really dangerous back in the day. These days we see moves in almost every race that they just didn´t do back then because they would have killed each others if so. But from Stewart´s point of view, you just don´t make such moves even if the cars are almost bullet proof these days. And I have to concur, I don´t like it at all. Neither Rosbergs late closing of the door or Hamilton "demanding space" move, hence why I feel that both of them has got to take their share of the responsibility.

I have to admit that I´m not 100 per cent sure about how much of the car the "leave room rule" requires though, but if it it´s just the nose inside the car in front, I´m in the wrong here rule wise. But I still don´t like is as I´ve seen so many such moves end up in tears throughout the years.
..
Just wanna add that I like both of them and hope we´ll get to see some racing between them soon too

Cheers

[Phil]

Hamilton and Rosberg decided at the same time to go to the right side. You can see that both cars are pointing to the right, while Hamilton is still behind. So it was not a case of pushing Hamilton off the track.

The only issue I have with the whole incident is, is that Rosberg was in the wrong mode and this lead to a huge speed difference between the two. As a driver, I'd be very hesitant to pull off a "blocking move" if I knew I was that much down on power. To do so anyway, IMO constitutes a dangerous, almost kamikaze like, maneuver and has little to do with racing anymore. The speed difference between the two was so large, that had Rosberg dove into the inside sooner, Hamilton would have just picked the outside and would have easily passed him around the outside. There was no way Rosberg would have been able to keep Hamilton behind, if not for that blocking move that basically pushed Hamilton beyond the track limit.

Also the rules are pretty clear on pushing other drivers off track and when a car is deemed to be "along side". I'd also argue that the "1 defensive move" is not there to push other drivers off the track - it is essentially a maneuver where a defending driver picks the inside to defend the apex (thus forcing the opponent around the outside) and gain an advantage through the corner. It's not to allow pushing others off the track.

As for simply "braking" - when you are closing in by that much, you are pretty much committed to the maneuver. Even if he had decided to pull out of that move, he still would have had to evade onto the grass and then you don't want to be on your brakes at all as it will mean you will lose control.

I'd actually give full marks to Hamilton to try to avoid the collision by going on the grass.

Having said that; I actually think Rosberg did the right thing from his position. Even if I think the move was dangerous and wrong and should have been penalized severely (on the basis of the speed difference and him knowing he was down on power), it was the best thing he could have done and IMO cements him as this years WDC. Sometimes you have to be a **** to make others realize that you will not make room and that you will defend your positions to the point of a DNF if necessary. This is what Hamilton did well in wheel to wheel racing for years now; He had the psychological edge over many other drivers to the point they simply yielded. Yes, this attitude sometimes or often leads to crashes, but it also gives you a psychological edge. Guaranteed; Hamilton might think twice about attempting an overtake vs Rosberg, especially if he is the one that has more to lose by a potential DNF.

It's going to be interesting how this clash affects them both. We still haven't had a race where we can both compare them side by side. Coming into the season, I was sure Hamilton had the edge again; he seemed very strong in qualifying and indeed there, he is in front. But two (three?) bad starts have basically ruined his races and he has failed to capitalize, now facing a huge task of closing a 43 point gap in 16 races in what IMO is still by far the most dominant car on the grid.

I've said it before and I am saying again; If I was a betting man, my money would be on Rosberg this year. It also hard to judge the internal team politics; I think Hamilton has always said the right things so far and I have not had the feeling that something is off (beyond the fact that Rosberg has won 4 races and he has had his fair share of bad luck with the car), but after this collision... who knows. Given that Mercedes is also German (perhaps not by team, but by ownership and the people in charge), I somehow do think that there might be people who might enjoy the situation that Rosberg might clinch this years title for the team. The Brit already has two after all. Will this break up the team? It's a tough question. I think the Redbull situation with Kvyat has shown how quickly sometimes things can go, especially when decisions are made higher up.

As a Hamilton supporter, I really would hate to see this happen, but I suppose the next few events will be very telling.

[lebesset]

Hamilton and Rosberg decided at the same time to go to the right side. You can see that both cars are pointing to the right, while Hamilton is still behind. So it was not a case of pushing Hamilton off the track.

The only issue I have with the whole incident is, is that Rosberg was in the wrong mode and this lead to a huge speed difference between the two. As a driver, I'd be very hesitant to pull off a "blocking move" if I knew I was that much down on power. To do so anyway, IMO constitutes a dangerous, almost kamikaze like, maneuver and has little to do with racing anymore. The speed difference between the two was so large, that had Rosberg dove into the inside sooner, Hamilton would have just picked the outside and would have easily passed him around the outside. There was no way Rosberg would have been able to keep Hamilton behind, if not for that blocking move that basically pushed Hamilton beyond the track limit.

Also the rules are pretty clear on pushing other drivers off track and when a car is deemed to be "along side". I'd also argue that the "1 defensive move" is not there to push other drivers off the track - it is essentially a maneuver where a defending driver picks the inside to defend the apex (thus forcing the opponent around the outside) and gain an advantage through the corner. It's not to allow pushing others off the track.

As for simply "braking" - when you are closing in by that much, you are pretty much committed to the maneuver. Even if he had decided to pull out of that move, he still would have had to evade onto the grass and then you don't want to be on your brakes at all as it will mean you will lose control.

I'd actually give full marks to Hamilton to try to avoid the collision by going on the grass.

Having said that; I actually think Rosberg did the right thing from his position. Even if I think the move was dangerous and wrong and should have been penalized severely (on the basis of the speed difference and him knowing he was down on power), it was the best thing he could have done and IMO cements him as this years WDC. Sometimes you have to be a **** to make others realize that you will not make room and that you will defend your positions to the point of a DNF if necessary. This is what Hamilton did well in wheel to wheel racing for years now; He had the psychological edge over many other drivers to the point they simply yielded. Yes, this attitude sometimes or often leads to crashes, but it also gives you a psychological edge. Guaranteed; Hamilton might think twice about attempting an overtake vs Rosberg, especially if he is the one that has more to lose by a potential DNF.

It's going to be interesting how this clash affects them both. We still haven't had a race where we can both compare them side by side. Coming into the season, I was sure Hamilton had the edge again; he seemed very strong in qualifying and indeed there, he is in front. But two (three?) bad starts have basically ruined his races and he has failed to capitalize, now facing a huge task of closing a 43 point gap in 16 races in what IMO is still by far the most dominant car on the grid.

I've said it before and I am saying again; If I was a betting man, my money would be on Rosberg this year. It also hard to judge the internal team politics; I think Hamilton has always said the right things so far and I have not had the feeling that something is off (beyond the fact that Rosberg has won 4 races and he has had his fair share of bad luck with the car), but after this collision... who knows. Given that Mercedes is also German (perhaps not by team, but by ownership and the people in charge), I somehow do think that there might be people who might enjoy the situation that Rosberg might clinch this years title for the team. The Brit already has two after all. Will this break up the team? It's a tough question. I think the Redbull situation with Kvyat has shown how quickly sometimes things can go, especially when decisions are made higher up.

As a Hamilton supporter, I really would hate to see this happen, but I suppose the next few events will be very telling.

wonder of wonders , even villeneuve , hardly a hamilton supporter , says rosberg was to blame 100%
hamilton's only mistake was not to let rosberg drive into him so that rosberg would get a penalty
I can only say that those that say hamilton wasn't partly alongside [ all that the rules demand ] haven't looked at the video in slow motion

the rest is politics

[Andres125sx]

You can´t find any other accident where responsability is as obvious as it is here

Really?

I just rewatched the incident a few times now.

Hamilton and Rosberg decided at the same time to go to the right side. You can see that both cars are pointing to the right, while Hamilton is still behind. So it was not a case of pushing Hamilton off the track.

Yes it is. You insist mentioning they started to move to the right at the same time, or Rosberg started first. Irrelevant. The only question is, there was a significant part of Lewis car (FW is enough) alongside Rosberg rear wheels before Hamilton went out of track as rules clarify?

An image is worth a thousand words


So basically case closed, Rosberg broke a rule wich is perfectly explained, so no interpretations allowed. This said, it is not a noob mistake, or something to blame Nico too hard, it all happend in tenths and he did what any normal racing driver would have done, once he realiced he was on a wrong power mode he tried to close the door, but it was too late then, Lewis already was going much faster so he should have closed the door earlier or leave one car width

Understandable mistake, but his mistake anycase

While Rosberg was late with his defence, Hamilton was also late with his attack.

How is that posible when he was only accelerating normally?

The incident was not caused by Hamilton being too optimistic about an overtaking chance (like Ricciardo with Vettel for example), and braking too late, the incident was caused by Rosberg going on the wrong power mode. All Hamilton did was, as soon as he saw Nico´s car getting closer, move to the right wich was the normal side to go.

Too late would have been if his FW crashed with Nico´s rear end, but it was not the case. Actually, if you watch the picture I´ve just posted, it proves the collision would have been between Nico´s rear tire lateral, and Lewis FW or front wheel lateral, wich proves Lewis earned that position and it was Nico who did the movement too late

Defending like this is racing.

No, as Phil already explained, that´s quite dirt (if done on purpose). If not, it´s just a mistake, but still a mistake as Lewis had earned the position according to the rules

[Jolle]

You can´t find any other accident where responsability is as obvious as it is here

Really?

I just rewatched the incident a few times now.

Hamilton and Rosberg decided at the same time to go to the right side. You can see that both cars are pointing to the right, while Hamilton is still behind. So it was not a case of pushing Hamilton off the track.

Yes it is. You insist mentioning they started to move to the right at the same time, or Rosberg started first. Irrelevant. The only question is, there was a significant part of Lewis car (FW is enough) alongside Rosberg rear wheels before Hamilton went out of track as rules clarify?

An image is worth a thousand words
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800x60 ... 3LkfD4.jpg

So basically case closed, Rosberg broke a rule wich is perfectly explained, so no interpretations allowed. This said, it is not a noob mistake, or something to blame Nico too hard, it all happend in tenths and he did what any normal racing driver would have done, once he realiced he was on a wrong power mode he tried to close the door, but it was too late then, Lewis already was going much faster so he should have closed the door earlier or leave one car width

Understandable mistake, but his mistake anycase

While Rosberg was late with his defence, Hamilton was also late with his attack.

How is that posible when he was only accelerating normally?

The incident was not caused by Hamilton being too optimistic about an overtaking chance (like Ricciardo with Vettel for example), and braking too late, the incident was caused by Rosberg going on the wrong power mode. All Hamilton did was, as soon as he saw Nico´s car getting closer, move to the right wich was the normal side to go.

Too late would have been if his FW crashed with Nico´s rear end, but it was not the case. Actually, if you watch the picture I´ve just posted, it proves the collision would have been between Nico´s rear tire lateral, and Lewis FW or front wheel lateral, wich proves Lewis earned that position and it was Nico who did the movement too late

Defending like this is racing.

No, as Phil already explained, that´s quite dirt (if done on purpose). If not, it´s just a mistake, but still a mistake as Lewis had earned the position according to the rules

What I don't get in this whole discussion, is Rosberg's history of "defending" his position on straights when in a speed disadvantage. I've seen him run cars off track at least twice before (Alonso and Hamilton). Circuits are not designed on big accidents on straights with two cars (before you know it, one ends up upside down on a barrier).

Hamilton was a bit optimistic maybe, but when you're "f-ed up" your settings and you are that much slower, you are a sitting duck, weaving and defending the track on that side that strongly is dangerous and wrong.

There is the possibility that Mercedes has come to the same conclusion and decided to keep it behind close doors. So much politics going on, knowing Hamilton especially, he would breathe fire in the press.

[Manoah2u]

politics have given Mercedes a 'get out of jail free card' BUT we don't know what's been discussed behind closed doors and what they expect from the drivers now.
For example, there might have been a decision that 'the driver whom puts his car @ P1 during qually, drives in front, and may not be overtaken' - something they could
really be adamant about @ a place like Monaco.

I therefor expect a vivid qually battle, to which Lewis has to admit Nico has been above him - i remember a statement about Lewis not being able or not thinking he could
brake past the bump just before the first corner, where Nico managed to master that skill - that puts Nico in an advantage in any way, even though the same quote states
Lewis finally mastered it.

I'm curious about whether we're gonna see another 'dirty' move during qually like in 2014. Quite frankly, i'm even slightly expecting something like that, as it would further
distort and screw with Lewis' mindset. Then again, if history serves Nico's memory well, he might remember his dirty tricks only managed to spice up Lewis to win the Championship.

I'm expecting a much more tamed and reserved Rosberg and Hamilton @ Monaco.
That is, unless the chitchat gossip is true that lewis actually has been replaced with Wehrlein due to an alleged brawl at a bar.
We'll know it thursday anyway., and then we'll see on Saturday just how things will unleash to a grand finale on sunday.

[WaikeCU]

Hamilton and Rosberg decided at the same time to go to the right side. You can see that both cars are pointing to the right, while Hamilton is still behind. So it was not a case of pushing Hamilton off the track.

The only issue I have with the whole incident is, is that Rosberg was in the wrong mode and this lead to a huge speed difference between the two. As a driver, I'd be very hesitant to pull off a "blocking move" if I knew I was that much down on power. To do so anyway, IMO constitutes a dangerous, almost kamikaze like, maneuver and has little to do with racing anymore. The speed difference between the two was so large, that had Rosberg dove into the inside sooner, Hamilton would have just picked the outside and would have easily passed him around the outside. There was no way Rosberg would have been able to keep Hamilton behind, if not for that blocking move that basically pushed Hamilton beyond the track limit.

Also the rules are pretty clear on pushing other drivers off track and when a car is deemed to be "along side". I'd also argue that the "1 defensive move" is not there to push other drivers off the track - it is essentially a maneuver where a defending driver picks the inside to defend the apex (thus forcing the opponent around the outside) and gain an advantage through the corner. It's not to allow pushing others off the track.

As for simply "braking" - when you are closing in by that much, you are pretty much committed to the maneuver. Even if he had decided to pull out of that move, he still would have had to evade onto the grass and then you don't want to be on your brakes at all as it will mean you will lose control.

I'd actually give full marks to Hamilton to try to avoid the collision by going on the grass.

Having said that; I actually think Rosberg did the right thing from his position. Even if I think the move was dangerous and wrong and should have been penalized severely (on the basis of the speed difference and him knowing he was down on power), it was the best thing he could have done and IMO cements him as this years WDC. Sometimes you have to be a **** to make others realize that you will not make room and that you will defend your positions to the point of a DNF if necessary. This is what Hamilton did well in wheel to wheel racing for years now; He had the psychological edge over many other drivers to the point they simply yielded. Yes, this attitude sometimes or often leads to crashes, but it also gives you a psychological edge. Guaranteed; Hamilton might think twice about attempting an overtake vs Rosberg, especially if he is the one that has more to lose by a potential DNF.

It's going to be interesting how this clash affects them both. We still haven't had a race where we can both compare them side by side. Coming into the season, I was sure Hamilton had the edge again; he seemed very strong in qualifying and indeed there, he is in front. But two (three?) bad starts have basically ruined his races and he has failed to capitalize, now facing a huge task of closing a 43 point gap in 16 races in what IMO is still by far the most dominant car on the grid.

I've said it before and I am saying again; If I was a betting man, my money would be on Rosberg this year. It also hard to judge the internal team politics; I think Hamilton has always said the right things so far and I have not had the feeling that something is off (beyond the fact that Rosberg has won 4 races and he has had his fair share of bad luck with the car), but after this collision... who knows. Given that Mercedes is also German (perhaps not by team, but by ownership and the people in charge), I somehow do think that there might be people who might enjoy the situation that Rosberg might clinch this years title for the team. The Brit already has two after all. Will this break up the team? It's a tough question. I think the Redbull situation with Kvyat has shown how quickly sometimes things can go, especially when decisions are made higher up.

As a Hamilton supporter, I really would hate to see this happen, but I suppose the next few events will be very telling.

I think Hamilton went off track, because he just couldn't go anywhere else. Lifting off would still be too late at that point regarding speed difference. The collision happened because Lewis lost control of his car on the grass. If Lewis hadn't moved off track, I don't want to know the consequences of what could have happened. Nico could have had a tap and go sideways head on into the concrete wall, which would have been similar to Alonso's pre-season freak accident last season, or far worse, wheels would have touched and then I don't want to know what would've happened to Lewis.

Regarding Lewis missing Monaco, maybe the press caught him smoking herbs, which would mean those substances would be still in his system when he's in the car on Thursday and if he has to take a test on illegal substances, he would test positive on that? I'm just thinking that could be the only reason.

[Roman]

Well, first of all, let me state that I pretty much agree with JC with regard to the Barcelona accident.

However, after reading the posts of the people thinking it was all Rosbergs fault due to not leaving space one question came to my mind (which I will ask even though I see the danger of - let's say - specific reactions): If Rosberg is to blame for the accident because he didn't leave enough space, wouldn't Hamilton be to blame for the Spa accident in '14? And why was it ok for Hamilton to push Rosberg out of the track in Suzuka and USA '15? In all three instances Ros had a portion of his car next to Ham.

I am not saying Hamilton is to blame for anything, just asking the question in order to understand the reasoning.

[Jolle]

Well, first of all, let me state that I pretty much agree with JC with regard to the Barcelona accident.

However, after reading the posts of the people thinking it was all Rosbergs fault due to not leaving space one question came to my mind (which I will ask even though I see the danger of - let's say - specific reactions): If Rosberg is to blame for the accident because he didn't leave enough space, wouldn't Hamilton be to blame for the Spa accident in '14? And why was it ok for Hamilton to push Rosberg out of the track in Suzuka and USA '15? In all three instances Ros had a portion of his car next to Ham.

I am not saying Hamilton is to blame for anything, just asking the question in order to understand the reasoning.

Although those maneuvers didn't win the "best driver award", there is a difference between keeping (close to) the racing line on a corner exit and blocking on a straight while having a huge speed deficit.

[jurinius]

As always

- Dislike Hamilton = lifestyle, arrogant, think he is Senna, incompatible f1 clothing, 3 times lucky WDC, Doesn't give enough respect or reconnaissance to god Mercedes given him the only car to win a championship now.

- Dislike Rosberg = Racing cheater, bad and weak as driver, Doesn't deserve a Mercedes super car, German driver

What are the most race related bad or right arguments ?

[Phil]

Well, first of all, let me state that I pretty much agree with JC with regard to the Barcelona accident.

However, after reading the posts of the people thinking it was all Rosbergs fault due to not leaving space one question came to my mind (which I will ask even though I see the danger of - let's say - specific reactions): If Rosberg is to blame for the accident because he didn't leave enough space, wouldn't Hamilton be to blame for the Spa accident in '14? And why was it ok for Hamilton to push Rosberg out of the track in Suzuka and USA '15? In all three instances Ros had a portion of his car next to Ham.

I am not saying Hamilton is to blame for anything, just asking the question in order to understand the reasoning.

Although those maneuvers didn't win the "best driver award", there is a difference between keeping (close to) the racing line on a corner exit and blocking on a straight while having a huge speed deficit.

This. I think what needs to be taken into consideration (to some degree) is common-sense. A car on corner exit will usually move towards the outside because it's on the limit of grip and the velocity will mean you can't simply "turn in sharper" after hitting the apex. If you hit the apex at velocity x, the car will be on a path that is somewhat predetermined. Also, a driver going into a corner will be looking at the apex, not at his side mirror (perhaps only with peripheral vision). This is effectively the Spa incident: Rosberg simply left his front-wing there and Hamilton had very limited view to know where Rosberg was and where his front-wing is. It's perhaps a racing incident too, but one Rosberg could avoid (he had a full view of what was happening), Hamilton less so because his view is towards the front, not the back.

If two cars go into a corner side by side, I think it's a matter of respect and the ability of both to do what is necessary to avoid collision. Naturally, the car on the outside is always at a disadvantage because he is taking the longer way around the corner and his path will naturally close because the car on the inside will usually move out and "close the door". For an overtake around the outside to work, it's crucial that that car is ahead to some degree which then puts the car on the inside at a disadvantage after the apex.

What happened in Barcelona is IMO very similar to Canada 2011 when Button pushed Hamilton beyond the track. Button had made a mistake which meant Hamilton was much quicker and as Button moved out (onto the racing line, not to block Hamilton; visibility was poor with the rain, he didn't see him), he pushed Hamilton into the wall. I back then argued that Button should have been punished because he was fully aware he made an error right before the incident, so was on the defensive. IMO he should have been aware of what was happening. IMO the same argument holds true in Barcelona too; Rosberg was in the wrong mode and when you have a power deficit, any "blocking move" you pull is dangerous and reckless. Considering the speed difference between the two; that position was lost and he only prevented that by blocking his opponent who had already committed to the overtake. As I said, if Rosberg had gone to the inside a split second sooner, I'm confident Hamilton would have committed to the outside and passed him quite easily.

Also, the rule set that people in here are pointing out, to the best of my knowledge, were introduced and clarified after Schumacher nearly pushed Barrichello into a wall on the straight of the GP I don't remember.

[zac510]

Phil, I also thought the Barcelona accident and the accident between Guttieriez and Alonso at Melbourne were very similar too; a slow, swerving defensive driver and a faster following driver. In both cases there was not enough time for the overtaking driver to react and change trajectory.

[flickerf1]

Well, first of all, let me state that I pretty much agree with JC with regard to the Barcelona accident.

However, after reading the posts of the people thinking it was all Rosbergs fault due to not leaving space one question came to my mind (which I will ask even though I see the danger of - let's say - specific reactions): If Rosberg is to blame for the accident because he didn't leave enough space, wouldn't Hamilton be to blame for the Spa accident in '14? And why was it ok for Hamilton to push Rosberg out of the track in Suzuka and USA '15? In all three instances Ros had a portion of his car next to Ham.

I am not saying Hamilton is to blame for anything, just asking the question in order to understand the reasoning.

Although those maneuvers didn't win the "best driver award", there is a difference between keeping (close to) the racing line on a corner exit and blocking on a straight while having a huge speed deficit.

This. I think what needs to be taken into consideration (to some degree) is common-sense. A car on corner exit will usually move towards the outside because it's on the limit of grip and the velocity will mean you can't simply "turn in sharper" after hitting the apex. If you hit the apex at velocity x, the car will be on a path that is somewhat predetermined. Also, a driver going into a corner will be looking at the apex, not at his side mirror (perhaps only with peripheral vision). This is effectively the Spa incident: Rosberg simply left his front-wing there and Hamilton had very limited view to know where Rosberg was and where his front-wing is. It's perhaps a racing incident too, but one Rosberg could avoid (he had a full view of what was happening), Hamilton less so because his view is towards the front, not the back.

If two cars go into a corner side by side, I think it's a matter of respect and the ability of both to do what is necessary to avoid collision. Naturally, the car on the outside is always at a disadvantage because he is taking the longer way around the corner and his path will naturally close because the car on the inside will usually move out and "close the door". For an overtake around the outside to work, it's crucial that that car is ahead to some degree which then puts the car on the inside at a disadvantage after the apex.

What happened in Barcelona is IMO very similar to Canada 2011 when Button pushed Hamilton beyond the track. Button had made a mistake which meant Hamilton was much quicker and as Button moved out (onto the racing line, not to block Hamilton; visibility was poor with the rain, he didn't see him), he pushed Hamilton into the wall. I back then argued that Button should have been punished because he was fully aware he made an error right before the incident, so was on the defensive. IMO he should have been aware of what was happening. IMO the same argument holds true in Barcelona too; Rosberg was in the wrong mode and when you have a power deficit, any "blocking move" you pull is dangerous and reckless. Considering the speed difference between the two; that position was lost and he only prevented that by blocking his opponent who had already committed to the overtake. As I said, if Rosberg had gone to the inside a split second sooner, I'm confident Hamilton would have committed to the outside and passed him quite easily.

Also, the rule set that people in here are pointing out, to the best of my knowledge, were introduced and clarified after Schumacher nearly pushed Barrichello into a wall on the straight of the GP I don't remember.

It was Hungary 2010. Here's a link to Ruben commentating over the lap itself: https://youtu.be/501o1YdtmPU

[Roman]

Thanks for the replies guys! I believe the "don't push cars off the track" rule basically applies no matter whether you are on the racing line or not, in a corner or on the straight etc. You seem to think otherwise but I will leave it like that.

However I found this excellent piece by f1metric regarding the “All the time you have to leave a space!” rules that shows things are not always as easy as one might think they are: https://f1metrics.wordpress.com/2014/08 ... of-racing/

Let's look forward to the Monaco GP now

[iotar__]

Firstly unquestionable fact: Wolff and Mercedes team are liars: "We cannot ask either driver to give up positions or jeopardise their own championship chances for the benefit of the team." They just did that to Rosberg in Monaco. Pretending it was his choice and he had other options is particularly low and worse than lying itself but that is just an opinion .

I only wish they'd stopped this nauseating back-patting. A driver that cuts off (Bahrain '14 - fact also know as event that happened whether you like it or not), pushes off track (Suzuka, USA - fact), crashes into team mate (fact), ignores team orders and ruins team's chance for a win (Hungary '14) is full of thank yous and gentleman this and that. How about you live by those "gentlemen" rules yourself? Talk is worthless.

Next time Rosberg is behind Hamilton and quicker I fully expect Wolff to tell him to get out of the way and Hamilton obliging. Anything else would be a clear example of unequal treatment of Mercedes drivers.