2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

[GPR-A duplicate2]

When a car is winning, the credit goes to the TD. Newey's car they say. They don't look at the person who designed that particular component to praise him for that.

Similarly since 2016 was supposed to be a Allison product and has sucked lemon till now, it is fair to attribute the failure at his feet.

If you are responsible for winning, you are for losing as well.

So every team bar Mercedes should fire their TD, they are all losing. Or maybe you can be doing a great job even if the team is losing or also doing a bad job even if the team is winning.

Correct. What changed after they fired Aldo Costa? What changed when they fired Tombazis? SF15-T was much better car and it was conceptualized and to large extent developed under his leadership. Luca Marmorini was also fired for developing what he was asked to develop, a small size PU.

For example: When Peter Prodromou left Red Bull, who was the second tallest aero leader in their ranks after Newey, Dan Fallows took over and they continue to remain a great aero team. You need depth at all levels. What Mercedes and Red Bull have done is, they have put right people at right places, with ready step up second in-lines. It should probably be true at all disciplines, that make them stay successful for a long time.

On the other hand, McLaren remains a team that has produced highest number of strong technical people that have moved over to other teams, but they have been unable to place them in the right places and hence suffering.

So, simply firing the top level leaders is not going to solve the problems. In a team sport like Formula One, no one individual can claim credit OR should the credit be associated to, for the success of the team. People like Newey and Brawn should be credited to have hired talented people and made them do the right job.

[evered7]

When a car is winning, the credit goes to the TD. Newey's car they say. They don't look at the person who designed that particular component to praise him for that.

Similarly since 2016 was supposed to be a Allison product and has sucked lemon till now, it is fair to attribute the failure at his feet.

If you are responsible for winning, you are for losing as well.

So every team bar Mercedes should fire their TD, they are all losing. Or maybe you can be doing a great job even if the team is losing or also doing a bad job even if the team is winning.

When you have a budget matching the leaders, it is expected to at least close the gap to them. Certainly not happened this year and as the other poster has mentioned Saturday is still an issue. The race pace is better line has been used one too much time without much evidence.

I expected them to better this year with the availability of softer tire option. But they are nowhere on pace nor on strategy on most weekends.

RB are able to produce a car with truck loads of DF every single year. Can't see a reason why Ferrari can't do it.

[Vasconia]

People like Newey and Brawn should be credited to have hired talented people and made them do the right job.

Brawn is a clear case, he didnt desing the WC winning cars but he has the appropiate people doing the right job. It was all about talent and good organisation.

[f1316]

People like Newey and Brawn should be credited to have hired talented people and made them do the right job.

Brawn is a clear case, he didnt desing the WC winning cars but he has the appropiate people doing the right job. It was all about talent and good organisation.

So this is exactly why I don't think you necessarily have to have a technical background in order to properly organise and structure an organisation - again, I'm sure most CEO's couldn't engineer their company's products if you put a gun to their heads.

And to further bhall's quote from Brawn, I think you could suggest that by taking the onus away from a big name tech director, Marchionne is allowing Ferrari to go about its work quickly and quietly - the attention is on him and to some extent arrivabene, not the engineers.

I have no idea if it will work- nor, I'd suggest, does anyone else - but I don't think it's completely senseless or illogical.

[Cold Fussion]

The difference is that a lot of CEO's come from a marketing/law or bean counting background, Ross Brawn worked as an engineer for many years before he lead a team.

[FW17]

The difference is that a lot of CEO's come from a marketing/law or bean counting background, Ross Brawn worked as an engineer for many years before he lead a team.

Brawn was a CEO?

[bhall II]

And to further bhall's quote from Brawn, I think you could suggest that by taking the onus away from a big name tech director, Marchionne is allowing Ferrari to go about its work quickly and quietly - the attention is on him and to some extent arrivabene, not the engineers.

Incessant saber-rattling isn't the tactic of someone who's letting his team work quietly:

"The team knows that the clock is on and we need to start winning some races and bringing them home."

"But anyone who doesn't bring results should leave. That is a rule that applies to everyone – even me."

And comments like this betray the nature of someone who's in way over his head:

"But the car will develop to the point where there is no distinguishable difference between us and them. That's really important because it will let the drivers run."

Contrast what's happening right now with this from December of 2014...

New Ferrari chairman Sergio Marchionne has admitted the Formula 1 team made "too many mistakes" in recent seasons and called upon the Scuderia to fulfil its potential.

Speaking alongside newly appointed F1 team principal Maurizio Arrivabene at the Scuderia's annual Christmas media briefing, Marchionne said the Italian squad had made too many errors in 2014 and needed major restructuring in order to improve.

"We have made too many mistakes," he said.

"For example, this [Arrivabene] is our third team principal this year.

"It [Ferrari's Formula 1 team] is not an easy thing to manage, but I have managed quite complex organisations before and we must be very clear: we must have a sense of belonging and belief that we can do well in 2015.

"We had a lot of unexpressed potential in 2014, so the big challenge is that in 2015 Ferrari will start to show the reconstruction of the whole team."

Marchionne's comments come in the wake of an extensive recent restructuring of Ferrari's F1 squad, including the confirmation of James Allison as outright technical chief, the departures of engineering director Pat Fry and chief designer Nikolas Tombazis, and the imminent arrival of Mercedes performance engineer Jock Clear.

Marchionne said he was optimistic the changes could bring much-needed cultural change to Ferrari's F1 operation.

"Speaking with my experience in even more complex situations, changing the leading roles can help a business very much," Marchionne added.

"But this is a huge experiment within our 'continuity concept'."

Arrivabene, previously a senior executive at tobacco giant Philip Morris, said Ferrari would judge him on his ability to put the right people in the right places as the Scuderia bids to recover from a winless 2014 campaign.

"In previous positions at least 50 per cent of my performance at the end of the year was assessed according to my capacity to identify and develop talents and make them grow," he said.

"This must be followed now."

It's a cycle that never seems to stop.

[Schuttelberg]

I think Ferrari's restructuring post 2014 was a good one. The main issue is that the main man is no longer there i.e James Allison. Mercedes won't be Mercedes without Paddy Lowe, likewise RedBull without Newey. The second issue is that Ferrari is dealing with the mistakes of the previous hierarchy, Also Costa is a fine example. You also have to look at the depth of the likes of RB who have a Dan Fallows or a James Key ready to step up in case of departure of the top brass. Ferrari don't have that. People here have been bashing the team about resources and results but the simple fact is that you need right people at the right places to utilise those resources. I'll repeat, Ferrari will take another three years to compete/win championships. Their fans need to be patient. The worst thing they can do is target to make short term developments/gains instead of laying a solid base for the 2017 regulations. Once you lay the groundwork for a particular set of regs you simply need to believe and back your philosophy until the results come. The challenge is to deal with lack of results and expectations in the time that the car is being developed to a winner. For this, you need the right people.

If you ask me, personally, stop the constant reshuffling. Believe in your people. Results will come.

[F1NAC]

Corrado Lanzone left the team

[scuderiafan]

...The worst thing they can do is target to make short term developments/gains instead of laying a solid base for the 2017 regulations. Once you lay the groundwork for a particular set of regs you simply need to believe and back your philosophy until the results come. The challenge is to deal with lack of results and expectations in the time that the car is being developed to a winner. For this, you need the right people.

If you ask me, personally, stop the constant reshuffling. Believe in your people. Results will come.

I absolutely agree. When you look at where Mercedes was in 2010/2011, they were fast but only "Top 5" fast. A few years later they're dominant. The point is, the core of the team stayed the same and they just kept working at it.

[GPR-A duplicate2]

When you look at where Mercedes was in 2010/2011, they were fast but only "Top 5" fast. A few years later they're dominant. The point is, the core of the team stayed the same and they just kept working at it.

Not true. The very reason on which Norbert Haug convinced Daimler to buy Brawn GP, was that it was a championship winning team and that too a low budgeted (low on resources too). It just took one year to understand that, the team is fundamentally weak. After a devastating 2011 season and a thorough drubbing of RRA (Resource Restriction Agreement), of which Brawn was a big evangelist, Brawn realized that, to compete and win, they need a budget of the size of Ferrari and Red Bull and then went on to convince Daimler for the same. As a first step, they fired Loic Bigiois who was their design chief, whose cars were struggling on aero front.

Then started a spree of hirings and from 2012, on board came Bob Bell, Mike Elliott, Geoff Willis and Aldo Costa. They grew from 200 (as Brawn GP laid off 275 people in 2009) odd people to 600. They had a base that was not a great one, with their V8 engine, unable to do off throttle blowing/coanda effect like that of Renault. They had a chassis which was a monster on tire eating. They had an UNEVOLVED (the team was humiliated and made fun of) front wing until 2013. There wasn't really anything that was carried over from 2010-2012, except for the experience and learnings of failures. New chiefs, new ways of doing things.

So, Mercedes situation was different from Ferrari. 2014 presented an opportunity and Mercedes/Daimler put all their eggs in that basket. An opportunity bargained by Ferrari.

In fact, the similarity is in the situation they are in . Failure of past seasons, a departed technical chief and an opportunity beckoning (2017).

[Juzh]

They had a base that was not a great one, with their V8 engine, unable to do off throttle blowing/coanda effect like that of Renault..

Ok, the rest of what you said I agree with, but this is pushing it a bit.

Speaking at the Motorsport Safety Fund’s Watkins Lecture at Autosport International, Newey said the team considered the switch because of Mercedes teams’ performance advantage in 2009.

Newey said:

"The Mercedes engine enjoyed a good advantage over the rest of the field last year. The lap time difference was significant – several tenths of a second. And when you have to find that kind of performance from the chassis, that’s quite a big ask.

But in the end Brawn and McLaren blocked us from having the Mercedes engine."
Adrian Newey

Mercedes V8 was not able to OT-blow in the way renault did, but did so in their own way which was not that far off. Now I honestly can't remember which teams used cold and which used hot blowing, but it was widely accepted at the time ferrari was by far the worst in that regard, not mercedes. And lets not forget mercedes did have an inherent advantage in power all the way from 2009 trough 2013.

[bhall II]

It's like he wants the team to suck...

Sergio Marchionne in the Racing Department wants to simplify procedures to speed up developments on the car. You do not win only with the quickest car

Can someone translate this? Google's translation is no easier for me to understand.

Ciò che ha sconvolto Sergio Marchionne è stato scoprire che nei cassetti di alcuni ingegneri del Cavallino, finiti in secondo piano nell'organizzazione di James Allison, sarebbero venute fuori diverse soluzioni tecniche che erano state proposte (e subito bocciate) e che poi si sono viste sulla Mercedes che per il terzo anno di fila sta dominando il mondiale.

http://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferrar ... ry-825226/

[Raleigh]

It's like he wants the team to suck...

Sergio Marchionne in the Racing Department wants to simplify procedures to speed up developments on the car. You do not win only with the quickest car

Can someone translate this? Google's translation is no easier for me to understand.

Ciò che ha sconvolto Sergio Marchionne è stato scoprire che nei cassetti di alcuni ingegneri del Cavallino, finiti in secondo piano nell'organizzazione di James Allison, sarebbero venute fuori diverse soluzioni tecniche che erano state proposte (e subito bocciate) e che poi si sono viste sulla Mercedes che per il terzo anno di fila sta dominando il mondiale.

http://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferrar ... ry-825226/

Paraphrasing what I can make out from translate,

Marchionne shocked to discover that Allison's team has shot down and discarded technical solutions from some lower level Ferrari engineers without trying them at a time when Mercedes have dominated 3 championships in a row.

If I'm reading this right, Marchionne seems to think Ferrari should be trying every technical solution that comes across the TDs desk in some frantic attempt to catch up to Mercedes. Not a good sign.

[ripper]

It's like he wants the team to suck...

Sergio Marchionne in the Racing Department wants to simplify procedures to speed up developments on the car. You do not win only with the quickest car

Can someone translate this? Google's translation is no easier for me to understand.

Ciò che ha sconvolto Sergio Marchionne è stato scoprire che nei cassetti di alcuni ingegneri del Cavallino, finiti in secondo piano nell'organizzazione di James Allison, sarebbero venute fuori diverse soluzioni tecniche che erano state proposte (e subito bocciate) e che poi si sono viste sulla Mercedes che per il terzo anno di fila sta dominando il mondiale.

http://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferrar ... ry-825226/

Little correction:

Marchionne was shocked to discover that Allison's team had shot down and discarded technical solutions from some lower level Ferrari engineers, that then were used on the Mercedes car that is dominating for the third year in a row.